We've launched the new forums! Read more here

Camilo Villegas Leaving Cobra For Taylormade

_JL_ said:
Haha I know it's pretty entertaining.
I'll add though, just because you started as a shoe company doesn't mean you're still a shoe company first and foremost. Most of these big athletic brands started as shoe companies.

Fun fact: Many probably already know this, but Adidas and Puma were started by opposing brothers (I think their name was Dessler) in Germany.
Click to expand...

Didn't they work together at first?
 
JB said:
It is like saying that because Titleist is owned by a liquor company that sponsorships should run across the board. Nike is one of the few companies that signs players across the board head to toe. adidas bought Taylormade in the hopes of doing the same thing, however they found it more successful to do separate contracts. Most golf companies (Nike, Taylormade/adidas, Acushnet, Puma, Callaway) have apparel and shoes. Cleveland/Srixon, Ping, and Adams, and a few others come to mind taht dont.

Callaways biggest player wears their shoes but not their clothes
Pumas biggest players wears their shoes but does not play their clubs
Cobras biggest players play their clubs but dont wear Puma clothes or shoes.

Its the same across the board. Very few companies can go head to toe anymore because too much money is out there in the form of separate sponsorships from clothing, shoes, etc....
Click to expand...

Yep thats true i just think its a unique situation and puma is trying to get it across that they own cobra now by getting their players to wear puma.
 
weezy109 said:
I bet they would love to have all of their players in head to toe adidas. I just think its not cool to bash a company like that by saying he left em for another reason than money and insinuating that it was over equipment. Unless you can get a pic of him holding up his contract with a sign saying my cobra clubs blew then i have to think otherwise . Yes i realize thats not what you said but that is what everyone is taking from it. I still think he was pressured to goto puma and probably had a fight over it or whatever and left or had a problem with the new management.
Click to expand...

Who is bashing them? What I said was that the deals were similar and he chose to leave. Nobody is saying he left because of the gear. What people said was "I wonder if that is the reason"? The same thing that people said about anybody that switches. Why did TW switch putters and back again? Was it because one was inferior? Or because he thought it would work better for him that day.

You are telling me that I should not make judgements on my opinion on why he chose to leave (yet I am the one that broke the story), yet you are coming back and saying you think he left because of pressure from Puma. Why is one opinion okay and not the other? Why does one side need proof and not the other? You have a thought that there was pressure and they had a fight over it (you just said that), yet for someone else with an opinion, you want to see a picture of the contract? Seems odd to me, but okay, I will just leave it at that.
 
JB said:
Who is bashing them? What I said was that the deals were similar and he chose to leave. Nobody is saying he left because of the gear. What people said was "I wonder if that is the reason"? The same thing that people said about anybody that switches. Why did TW switch putters and back again? Was it because one was inferior? Or because he thought it would work better for him that day.

You are telling me that I should not make judgements on my opinion on why he chose to leave (yet I am the one that broke the story), yet you are coming back and saying you think he left because of pressure from Puma. Why is one opinion okay and not the other? Why does one side need proof and not the other? You have a thought that there was pressure and they had a fight over it (you just said that), yet for someone else with an opinion, you want to see a picture of the contract? Seems odd to me, but okay, I will just leave it at that.
Click to expand...

Hell this has all been my opinion there hasn't been one fact in anything i said really, i just don't think he would leave for the reasons being bandied about in here. Especially since he hasn't been playin poorly at all just putting poorly. Its not personal just a good debate i thought.
 
weezy109 said:
Hell this has all been my opinion there hasn't been one fact in anything i said really, i just don't think he would leave for the reasons being bandied about in here. Especially since he hasn't been playin poorly at all just putting poorly. Its not personal just a good debate i thought.
Click to expand...

This is THP. Its always just a good debate.
 
weezy109 said:
Didn't they work together at first?
Click to expand...
I don't believe so, could be wrong. I'm just going by what I remember from a Puma brand analysis project I did last year.

Another fun fact: All that "adidas stands, for all day I dream about soccer" talk is total BS. The founders name was Adolf "Adi" Dassler, he just named the company after himself.
 
By the way, I was reading about this topic on another forum (which shall remain nameless), and someone said Camilo already uses a Superfast 3 wood, and was practicing at the RBC with a Superfast 5 wood. Am I the only one who didn't know that?
 
_JL_ said:
I don't believe so, could be wrong. I'm just going by what I remember from a Puma brand analysis project I did last year.

Another fun fact: All that "adidas stands, for all day I dream about soccer" talk is total BS. The founders name was Adolf "Adi" Dassler, he just named the company after himself.
Click to expand...

There have been a few companies started by warring brothers
 
JB good point bringing up the Auschnet/Jim Beam relationship
i have to say not to stir it up but JB has the hook up, somehow he always knows and usually is spot on(if not he is really dang close). so when he says the contracts are very close in money what else can you see him making a change for. maybe his new clubs just werent getting it done or he was afraid cobra would suffer from losing Auschnet money, which lets be honest who spends more in golf R&D. i dont think it was puma pressuring him they have their big gun clothing kid, I brought it up as an alternative. Also im not saying Cobra clubs suck or that they arent even good, i am saying Taylormade is better. you can take the idea that they made him leave for not signing with Puma out also, he is number one or two on Cobra's team you really think that they would look at him and say ok you dont want to wear our stuff see ya later... NO IT WOULD KILL BUSINESS FOR THEM, it might have been new people true, maybe they didnt get along. however as previously stated what is probably most likely is that he wanted to make a change to see if he could find something that fit his game a little better and if the reports he is working with some TM clubs already i dont see why he wouldnt make the switch
 
TOAOST21 said:
JB good point bringing up the Auschnet/Jim Beam relationship
i have to say not to stir it up but JB has the hook up, somehow he always knows and usually is spot on(if not he is really dang close). so when he says the contracts are very close in money what else can you see him making a change for. maybe his new clubs just werent getting it done or he was afraid cobra would suffer from losing Auschnet money, which lets be honest who spends more in golf R&D. i dont think it was puma pressuring him they have their big gun clothing kid, I brought it up as an alternative. Also im not saying Cobra clubs suck or that they arent even good, i am saying Taylormade is better. you can take the idea that they made him leave for not signing with Puma out also, he is number one or two on Cobra's team you really think that they would look at him and say ok you dont want to wear our stuff see ya later... NO IT WOULD KILL BUSINESS FOR THEM, it might have been new people true, maybe they didnt get along. however as previously stated what is probably most likely is that he wanted to make a change to see if he could find something that fit his game a little better and if the reports he is working with some TM clubs already i dont see why he wouldnt make the switch
Click to expand...

There is no such thing as better. There is only better for you. Taylormade clubs and cobra clubs are built in china or mexico by the lowest bidder put together with the cheapest materials using the cheapest techniques by the cheapest workers and marketed like they were carved from rare moon rocks. As long as they aren't glued together with asbestos infused epoxy then i'm happy. But no they aren't "better". See the r9 iron thread on here for example. Best advise for buying clubs is buy stuff with the least amount of "technology" (in other words cheap rubber and plastic crap that will eventually fall off). He also said they were "real close." Why didn't cobra up the offer if this spelled the death nell for them? Maybe they are working on a deal for a really big name? I mean Camillo gets more press for his looks than his golf game. He has like 3 wins and no majors.
 
This is just an opinion but suppose he left because of support. What I mean is you hear how much Nike and TM help their guys out both on and off the course with equipment and such. I'm sure it was a bunch of small things and not just one big one.
 
_JL_ said:
By the way, I was reading about this topic on another forum (which shall remain nameless), and someone said Camilo already uses a Superfast 3 wood, and was practicing at the RBC with a Superfast 5 wood. Am I the only one who didn't know that?
Click to expand...

Im going to go out on a limb and say there was no credit given to THP for breaking this story right? Typical!

weezy109 said:
There is no such thing as better. There is only better for you. Taylormade clubs and cobra clubs are built in china or mexico by the lowest bidder put together with the cheapest materials using the cheapest techniques by the cheapest workers and marketed like they were carved from rare moon rocks. As long as they aren't glued together with asbestos infused epoxy then i'm happy. But no they aren't "better". See the r9 iron thread on here for example. Best advise for buying clubs is buy stuff with the least amount of "technology" (in other words cheap rubber and plastic crap that will eventually fall off). He also said they were "real close." Why didn't cobra up the offer if this spelled the death nell for them? Maybe they are working on a deal for a really big name? I mean Camillo gets more press for his looks than his golf game. He has like 3 wins and no majors.
Click to expand...

Every other companies woods are made the same way by the way such as Ping, Callaway, Nike, etc...
To me there are certainly better and not better. All OEMs are making very good equipment, but there are certainly stand outs.
You say only better for an individual! Well then perhaps the equipment is BETTER FOR HIM? Who knows, but maybe!
I could not disagree more about technology!!! Not all technology means that. How about foam inside iron heads? How about different perimeter weighting? I love how one product had QC on the early batch and that is what it means. I suppose FCT is not technology and that will just fall apart. I think we should all play blades I guess since they have little new technology to them.
You say he gets more press for looks than his golf game. You say he has 3 wins and no majors. Wait, how is that not better than their highest ranked player IJP? Its virtually the same, but with more PGA wins. Or heck their entire stable. The fact is, Camilo is one of the few guys that actually does cause a "bump in the needle" on viewership and this is a HUGE WIN for Taylormade Golf and a HUGE LOSS for Cobra/PUMA. Will they sign other guys? Of course they will, they certainly have to now, but to disregard this is just frankly wrong in the world of golf business.

As for why Cobra did not up the offer? The truth is that they did not get the chance to. He met with the TM people and his agent at his home in Orlando. He came away with a deal. There was no counter offering, there was no let me see what Cobra says. Nothing of the sort.
 
i have a hard time believing that camilo's switch had anything to do with money....JB's informed us many times that the offers were too close, and it's not like he's sweating over how much he's getting for his equipment endorsements. to me, it has to boil down to the fact that camilo is looking to better his game through an equipment change, something that WE ALL DO!

adding camilo to the stable is huge for TM and i'll be interested to see how he plays next year.
 
Maybe it has to do with the size of the company? I mean, TM probably has alot more R&D dollars, and maybe he figures becasue they are on the leading edge for equipment, that be reupping with cobra, he could be getting left behind on something that could help his game immensely.
 
JB said:
Im going to go out on a limb and say there was no credit given to THP for breaking this story right? Typical!



Every other companies woods are made the same way by the way such as Ping, Callaway, Nike, etc...
To me there are certainly better and not better. All OEMs are making very good equipment, but there are certainly stand outs.
You say only better for an individual! Well then perhaps the equipment is BETTER FOR HIM? Who knows, but maybe!
I could not disagree more about technology!!! Not all technology means that. How about foam inside iron heads? How about different perimeter weighting? I love how one product had QC on the early batch and that is what it means. I suppose FCT is not technology and that will just fall apart. I think we should all play blades I guess since they have little new technology to them.
You say he gets more press for looks than his golf game. You say he has 3 wins and no majors. Wait, how is that not better than their highest ranked player IJP? Its virtually the same, but with more PGA wins. Or heck their entire stable. The fact is, Camilo is one of the few guys that actually does cause a "bump in the needle" on viewership and this is a HUGE WIN for Taylormade Golf and a HUGE LOSS for Cobra/PUMA. Will they sign other guys? Of course they will, they certainly have to now, but to disregard this is just frankly wrong in the world of golf business.

As for why Cobra did not up the offer? The truth is that they did not get the chance to. He met with the TM people and his agent at his home in Orlando. He came away with a deal. There was no counter offering, there was no let me see what Cobra says. Nothing of the sort.
Click to expand...


Awesome post. Not much to say or debate beyond that.....

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
And JB lays down the hammer...cause he knows all
 
JB said:
Im going to go out on a limb and say there was no credit given to THP for breaking this story right? Typical!
Click to expand...
Actually there was!
But you don't want to know what the folks were saying about thp after that...
 
JB said:
You say he gets more press for looks than his golf game. You say he has 3 wins and no majors. Wait, how is that not better than their highest ranked player IJP? Its virtually the same, but with more PGA wins. Or heck their entire stable. The fact is, Camilo is one of the few guys that actually does cause a "bump in the needle" on viewership and this is a HUGE WIN for Taylormade Golf and a HUGE LOSS for Cobra/PUMA. Will they sign other guys? Of course they will, they certainly have to now, but to disregard this is just frankly wrong in the world of golf business.
Click to expand...

Werent 2 of themplayoff wins? Werent they back to back aswell? Camilo is exciting and dynamic. I think he's a great fit for TM
 
Yeah, it's quite unfair to say Camilo is known more for his looks.
Actually I think he's kind of underrated this year, he's playing very well.
 
_JL_ said:
Actually there was!
But you don't want to know what the folks were saying about thp after that...
Click to expand...

All I care about is credit. We give it, and we want others to as well. People can have their own opinion of this site or any other. I know I have a few myself. The members make up a forum and this one has the best members I have ever come across.

_JL_ said:
Yeah, it's quite unfair to say Camilo is known more for his looks.
Actually I think he's kind of underrated this year, he's playing very well.
Click to expand...

Agreed 100%
 
Thainer21 said:
Maybe it has to do with the size of the company? I mean, TM probably has alot more R&D dollars, and maybe he figures becasue they are on the leading edge for equipment, that be reupping with cobra, he could be getting left behind on something that could help his game immensely.
Click to expand...

Seeing as how acushnet owns it I doubt money is the problem. It may be the fact that acushnet owns it though. You don't see near as many guys playing titleist anymore and there has to be a reason for it. I'd assume there is alot of ego over there.
 
Degoins said:
Seeing as how acushnet owns it I doubt money is the problem. It may be the fact that acushnet owns it though. You don't see near as many guys playing titleist anymore and there has to be a reason for it. I'd assume there is alot of ego over there.
Click to expand...

Acushnet does not own them anymore.
 
Degoins said:
Seeing as how acushnet owns it I doubt money is the problem. It may be the fact that acushnet owns it though. You don't see near as many guys playing titleist anymore and there has to be a reason for it. I'd assume there is alot of ego over there.
Click to expand...

but acushnet doesn't own cobra any more, that's all puma's now.

edit: damn JB and his quick fingers!!
 
Ahh, must have missed that one.
 
yeah Auschnet said they wanted to put more into FJ and Titleist than worry about running all three
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top