Future of Product Testing on THP

[Mardin]

I'm still fairly new to this site and one of the reasons I joined the site was "reviews by the people, for the people." The reviews give us all on the forum a fresh perspective almost each and everytime. I enjoy reading what different people have to say about different clubs. Sure it's nice to get reviews from the "experts," but that material can get stale and repetetive, and as much as one writer tries to be unbiased it may sometimes shine through. I enjoy reading what people have to say about certain clubs..good or bad. I enjoy the member-to-member dialouge that plays out every day here at THP, that's one thing that seperates THP from other sites; the idea of being a community. I agree with many of the previous posters.."if its not broke, dont fix it."

 

[Bridges]

Again, I disagree. I do not think that people need to come on and tell someone their review is terrible but I do think they could use some words of encouragement and say "Hey man, I am glad you like xyz or I interested in why you disliked xyz can you elaborate some more on that?" I want there to be more discussion and I want to have the readers express to the testers what they want to read. No one can improve on their reviewing skills if they don't know what people are looking for. I would strongly encourage people to comment on reviews and let the reviewer know what they liked and disliked. Of course always doing it in a civil way.



Exactly and maybe that tester doesn't know that they aren't providing the type of information that the readers are looking for. We should be helping everyone to give the best feedback possible. It's not about criticizing it's about encouraging.

Wait, I agree with you on that. I didnt think I ever said otherwise? Maybe just thought I was saying something else? I agree with that in bold.

 

[tomahawk18]

I never said one had more merit over the other, but that i would put more of my "reading" efforts into the one from the tester who gives back. Sorry if you don't like that, but I don't like that people who test things don't give back to the site. I think that's fair enough. Why are you so defensive about this anyway?

I am really not that defensive over it. Just dissagree thats all. I'm not looking for freebies around here. I just like the forum and love golf. And if I test a product or two, I will consider myself lucky. But I will not discount anyones reviews, donor or not.

 

[Dent]

Yes, exactly. I think we are trying to say the same things, its just coming out different. Im all for the asking questions to get more info, just the part about what TomaHawk said in his first post about calling reviews terrible is the part I dont agree with. I think JB and GG should be the only ones to be allowed to say that.

I agree with this and so far none of that "You're review sucks" has come out yet but perhaps one day will.
I think Bridges is just trying to get across obviously some encouragement to give a little more info is appropriate but calling out someone and saying their review is bad or their write up isn't very good in public can be pretty humiliating. I sure would feel terrible if someone said that to me.

 

[StLCardsFan]

I’m here to engage in some golf related discussions and occasionally give my opinion if I feel I can help someone out. I have little time to play with the stuff I have, so I don’t have any need to even try and test new equipment so on those topics I pay very little attention to them. I can’t buy anything new anyway, so there isn’t much point me even reading what others think. So when those threads pop up I usually just pass them by.

Even the homepage reviews I rarely read. It is nice to know what new stuff is out there, but I have no desire to buy any so I really don’t even bother looking. My problem with such a subjective subject like golf equipment is that everyone will have their own opinion. One or two people testing a club and writing about it isn’t really going to help me that much anyway. They could have completely different styles of play than me so their opinion doesn’t mean much to me anyway. If I need something new, I’ll do my own testing with whatever I can find. I might then go back and look at reviews to compare and confirm my thoughts, but I won’t base a decision on what a couple of people thought.

One problem that I see you have is that there are a lot of people that want to see their name in lights. They want to be the one that has a write up that tons of people will comment on and ask them questions about. It makes them feel special that it was their work and they get to influence others with their opinion. There is nothing wrong with that, it is just human nature. In the internet age, every company and product has a review somewhere and whoever writes it has the most influence. With the forum testing, that is what you have created. People want to be that star.

The other main problem is the free stuff. People in general, but golfers specifically are ate up about getting free gear. Who wouldn’t? There is always something new that might be better than what you have. But I think most of you problem lies in that you have more and more people just wanting the free stuff. You’ve kind of created a monster with it. I understand why it is done, but the more free stuff there is the more people who will come just for the free stuff. Who’s to say who the honest people are as well? You could send me a driver and I take it to the range. I could hit 10 balls with it and then give you 2000 words on it (mostly made up, but who’s going to know, it’s just my opinion). I then sell it or trade it in for something else. I wouldn’t do that, but I bet many people would just for the free driver.

Do we just add more people to our staff and send to them only for testing? This is your best option IMO. Pick a few somewhat anonymous people that you can trust to give you a quality write up. Maybe those people will have a small circle of competent golfers around them that can give additional input to the story. That would help in comparing/contrasting different things about the product so that it isn’t entirely one person’s opinion.

Do we start a VIP program and only members of that program are eligible? Not a good idea IMO. Then you will be inundated with people wanting to be a VIP. And that exclusivity will only separate what you have created. I think it would create a ‘good ole boys’ network that have a hand in every topic and every thread and everything will end up liked or dislike based on the opinions of a few. You would also see backlash in the future with members assuming there is favoritism among the VIPs on other things.

Do we just scrap it completely and not do forum testing anymore and just do contests? I would scrap it completely. If it is just going to cause the animosity among members you don’t need that headache. Kind of like bringing cupcakes to grade school for your birthday, if you can’t involve everyone, don’t involve anyone.

Of course, these are just my opinions. You have a privately owned company and quite frankly you can do what you want. If that pisses off some people so what, just be a duck. You’re never going to please everyone, and I certainly don’t think you should ever let it bother you.

 

[JRamz]

Guys, I am not attacking either of you. I have been here for a while. I have seen people piss and moan about poker chips selling out, so THP orders more, then it takes forever for them to sale them. I have seen people ask for hats, THP gets hats, they still have them. I have seen people get upset b/c the outing fills up, THP calls PGA NAtional, requests more slots, guess what, they don't fill up quickly. DO they go eventually? Yes, but that's money out of THP's pocket. All I'm saying is, if you want to throw your name in the hat to test something and you are selected, please give back to the site. It costs them to ship the items. By donating or supporting the store, you are saying thank you for the opportunity, you are supporting the place that is putting goods in your hands.

I have every right to take from a review what I choose to. I know who's here for the right reasons and who's not (again, this is not directed at either of you). Just as you are disappointed in my post, I'm just as disappointed that you haven't supported THP. Are we both entitled to these disappointments? I believe so.

Sorry if I let you down, not my intention.

I understand it's not a personal attack. You have obviously invested alot personally into THP and I can appreciate your passion.

 

[Mustng5]

I disagree. I want details of why it wasn't for them. Not 60 words that say "I hit it, and didn't like it. Thanks for the opportunity"

I understand that, but thats their version of an HONEST review, im sure there were other reviews that would give you the information you were looking for. Dont let one bad review stop your quest for information. Some people are pretty bias, they want a ball that spins so if it doesnt spin they dont like it, they want their balls to do what they see the pros balls do, they dont want the ball that might truly help their game, I understand your point, but if someone only has negative points from a ball thats there HONEST review, and im sure in 60 characters that they gave you atleast ONE reason that they didnt like the ball or club they were testing...not everyone is going to give you a dissertation.

 

[Bridges]

I agree with this and so far none of that "You're review sucks" has come out yet but perhaps one day will.
I think Bridges is just trying to get across obviously some encouragement to give a little more info is appropriate but calling out someone and saying their review is bad or their write up isn't very good in public can be pretty humiliating. I sure would feel terrible if someone said that to me.

Exactly. I thought I was saying that, but my writing skills are sub par. ha
I have seen it 1 time so far.

 

[GolferGal]

Wait, I agree with you on that. I didnt think I ever said otherwise? Maybe just thought I was saying something else? I agree with that in bold.

I was agreeing with you on that part. Sorry I was typing fast in order to keep up with this thread.

 

[CharlieMoy]

Good post cardsfan

I’m here to engage in some golf related discussions and occasionally give my opinion if I feel I can help someone out. I have little time to play with the stuff I have, so I don’t have any need to even try and test new equipment so on those topics I pay very little attention to them. I can’t buy anything new anyway, so there isn’t much point me even reading what others think. So when those threads pop up I usually just pass them by.

Even the homepage reviews I rarely read. It is nice to know what new stuff is out there, but I have no desire to buy any so I really don’t even bother looking. My problem with such a subjective subject like golf equipment is that everyone will have their own opinion. One or two people testing a club and writing about it isn’t really going to help me that much anyway. They could have completely different styles of play than me so their opinion doesn’t mean much to me anyway. If I need something new, I’ll do my own testing with whatever I can find. I might then go back and look at reviews to compare and confirm my thoughts, but I won’t base a decision on what a couple of people thought.

One problem that I see you have is that there are a lot of people that want to see their name in lights. They want to be the one that has a write up that tons of people will comment on and ask them questions about. It makes them feel special that it was their work and they get to influence others with their opinion. There is nothing wrong with that, it is just human nature. In the internet age, every company and product has a review somewhere and whoever writes it has the most influence. With the forum testing, that is what you have created. People want to be that star.

The other main problem is the free stuff. People in general, but golfers specifically are ate up about getting free gear. Who wouldn’t? There is always something new that might be better than what you have. But I think most of you problem lies in that you have more and more people just wanting the free stuff. You’ve kind of created a monster with it. I understand why it is done, but the more free stuff there is the more people who will come just for the free stuff. Who’s to say who the honest people are as well? You could send me a driver and I take it to the range. I could hit 10 balls with it and then give you 2000 words on it (mostly made up, but who’s going to know, it’s just my opinion). I then sell it or trade it in for something else. I wouldn’t do that, but I bet many people would just for the free driver.

Do we just add more people to our staff and send to them only for testing? This is your best option IMO. Pick a few somewhat anonymous people that you can trust to give you a quality write up. Maybe those people will have a small circle of competent golfers around them that can give additional input to the story. That would help in comparing/contrasting different things about the product so that it isn’t entirely one person’s opinion.

Do we start a VIP program and only members of that program are eligible? Not a good idea IMO. Then you will be inundated with people wanting to be a VIP. And that exclusivity will only separate what you have created. I think it would create a ‘good ole boys’ network that have a hand in every topic and every thread and everything will end up liked or dislike based on the opinions of a few. You would also see backlash in the future with members assuming there is favoritism among the VIPs on other things.

Do we just scrap it completely and not do forum testing anymore and just do contests? I would scrap it completely. If it is just going to cause the animosity among members you don’t need that headache. Kind of like bringing cupcakes to grade school for your birthday, if you can’t involve everyone, don’t involve anyone.

Of course, these are just my opinions. You have a privately owned company and quite frankly you can do what you want. If that pisses off some people so what, just be a duck. You’re never going to please everyone, and I certainly don’t think you should ever let it bother you.

 

[GolferGal]

I am really not that defensive over it. Just dissagree thats all. I'm not looking for freebies around here. I just like the forum and love golf. And if I test a product or two, I will consider myself lucky. But I will not discount anyones reviews, donor or not.

I agree with this. I don't think a review should be judged in a certain way based on whether or not the person donated. But I am starting to think that one of the best ways to fix this issue is to start charging people for shipping. I hate to do that but with the amount of testing we are doing these days maybe it's the best choice. Plus it could open up the door to allow international testers.

 

[tomahawk18]

Anything is possible, however we do send over specific rules to those that get selected and they always start with 1. ALL WE WANT IS HONESTY. Outside of that, I am not sure what we can do.



I echo your thoughts.



Again I think what TC is saying is that if someone receives a set of irons lets say from THP and does not hit the donate button to at least cover the shipping cost, it bugs him. Again, just my interpretation of his thoughts.

Again, maybe you guys arent understanding me. I think everyone who can donate, should donate... PERIOD. 100%. And while I don't dissagree with his thoughts on donating in general, he could be missing out on great reviews if he doesn't read non donators stuff. Also, there are people out there that are not in a position to donate. Just try to remember that.

 

[ddec]

do people think they are entitled to testing because they are on the forum? I'm trying to figure out why people get all upset when they aren't picked for testing

 

[adwillingham]

I think testing is a lot harder than people think it is.

I will admit that for me personally, I have done a really poor job testing golf balls twice now, to the point that I will not enter my name into any future ball testing opportunities. My main issue is that testing a golf ball requires course time, and while I can easily get to the range twice a week if I needed to, I have trouble getting to the course...and it is very hard to test a golf ball at the range (you only get one chance).

I say that a) as a mea culpa and b) as something that people need to think about as they agree to perform any testing.

 

[Bridges]

I was agreeing with you on that part. Sorry I was typing fast in order to keep up with this thread.

Haha no worries. I get what your saying and I was trying to say the same thing but yours just came out better and more sophisticated (woah big word) than what i was trying to say.

Questions are very encouraged in testing as well as pointing out what you want to see from the testers but not the "I think your review is terrible" comment in the thread is basically what im saying.

 

[Snap Hook]

I agree with this. I don't think a review should be judged in a certain way based on whether or not the person donated. But I am starting to think that one of the best ways to fix this issue is to start charging people for shipping. I hate to do that but with the amount of testing we are doing these days maybe it's the best choice. Plus it could open up the door to allow international testers.

I seriously doubt you'll get much opposition to charging testers shipping costs.

 

[the boss]

I agree with this. I don't think a review should be judged in a certain way based on whether or not the person donated. But I am starting to think that one of the best ways to fix this issue is to start charging people for shipping. I hate to do that but with the amount of testing we are doing these days maybe it's the best choice. Plus it could open up the door to allow international testers.

i agree with you i wouldnt mind paying the postage to the uk to test a ball thats going on the market earlt even if the postage was worth more than the balls. i feel i could give total newbies to golf like myself some good reviews

 

[Dent]

I agree with this. I don't think a review should be judged in a certain way based on whether or not the person donated. But I am starting to think that one of the best ways to fix this issue is to start charging people for shipping. I hate to do that but with the amount of testing we are doing these days maybe it's the best choice. Plus it could open up the door to allow international testers.

I don't think anyone would have a problem with it GG. I was glad to pay for shipping with the 4 wood and I think people are so appreciative of being chosen that shipping is just a minimal charge for testing the product. If some people don't like it, don't enter to test things and just enjoy the forum without product.

 

[CharlieMoy]

Although I like the idea, and think it could weed out alot of the people wanting free stuff. Theyre still getting a set of irons for 30 bucks which is practically free(situational). And it eliminates the 'common man' that may be trying hard to be the best he can be on here but maybe cant afford all that much.

I agree with this. I don't think a review should be judged in a certain way based on whether or not the person donated. But I am starting to think that one of the best ways to fix this issue is to start charging people for shipping. I hate to do that but with the amount of testing we are doing these days maybe it's the best choice. Plus it could open up the door to allow international testers.

 

[McRock]

To add to my previous comments and in response to a few posts on here.

I have only participated in a couple of 'product testing' threads. One of them, I was fairly critical of the price tag of a golf training aid. The best part of it was that I got a response, and it was civil. Good luck getting that on any other forum on the net. The second testing thread was for some irons. I asked some pretty specific questions, like how my 10 year old irons compared to these new irons. You could only get a response to a question like that on a large golfing forum like this. And when I was pretty sure I understood the testers comments on turf interaction, but wanted to be completely sure I understood, I simply asked, and they answered. As some others have said, the testers are great. If they miss something, we as the readers simply need to ask. I've always had my questions answered.

If it's not broke, don't fix it.

 

[TwoSolitudes]

TC aren't the reviews themselves giving back to the site. Without them the forum members and their opinions then we are just reading the reviews of one person and the manufacturers and marketing companies that supply these products are just getting the review from the people that run the site. Like I said before, I didn't pay any attention to the donor tag, but yes I will be donating because I have received free advice from the site on my swing several times and I have learned a lot from people on these forums. But I don't think that I should be alienated in reviews or looked down upon by the staff for not donating, if that is the case then why not start soliciting donations by telling people there opinion doesn't matter unless they give money. I would have no problem paying for shipping on anything THP sent me, but I have never been selected, so how would I know if they didn't already do that?

Agree 100%

 

[tomahawk18]

I understand that, but thats their version of an HONEST review, im sure there were other reviews that would give you the information you were looking for. Dont let one bad review stop your quest for information. Some people are pretty bias, they want a ball that spins so if it doesnt spin they dont like it, they want their balls to do what they see the pros balls do, they dont want the ball that might truly help their game, I understand your point, but if someone only has negative points from a ball thats there HONEST review, and im sure in 60 characters that they gave you atleast ONE reason that they didnt like the ball or club they were testing...not everyone is going to give you a dissertation.

To me, if you are signing up for a blind product review, you owe it to THP to do a little more than a paragraph, whether you like the product or not.

 

[CharlieMoy]

But people dont always do that.

Agree 100%

 

[JB]

Again, maybe you guys arent understanding me. I think everyone who can donate, should donate... PERIOD. 100%. And while I don't dissagree with his thoughts on donating in general, he could be missing out on great reviews if he doesn't read non donators stuff. Also, there are people out there that are not in a position to donate. Just try to remember that.

Those were not my words, but speaking in trying to understand TC's. After reading all the posts again, his thoughts, while are his own, are things that get discussed. Like someone that gets selected for a nice piece of equipment, but complains that we dont ship it fast enough (not directed at anybody). Its about a community, not about people not donating.

do people think they are entitled to testing because they are on the forum? I'm trying to figure out why people get all upset when they aren't picked for testing

But people are upset and that is what we want to fix. We hate that side of it.

 

[Mistersauga]

Being a relatively new member, it never crossed my mind that being able to test product was a chance for free gear. My number one interest in the site and forums is being informed. From what I have seen your testers are excellent and provide info you won't get anywhere else. I agree, being a tester is a lot harder and requires a lot more time than we think. JB, this is a great site and i will keep referring to it no matter what you decide. TC, being a feloow lefty I feel our pain. However, up here is the Great White North, we may have it better because there are so many of us. Cheers.