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Convinced my nephew to change majors

Slot708

Slot708

🤦‍♂️ hardcore DOS gamer
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My nephew was a straight A student at Mississippi State in their business program.Which specialized in the Golf Course Management program to become a PGA pro at a course.We had a sit down with the family and convinced him working in a pro shop is a dead end deal.He loves golf and was admitted into the agronomy program at another university.Was this wise of us getting him to convert?Hope we didn’t over step our boundaries.But seems like being a greens keeper would allow more opportunities than a pro shop manager,assistant golf pro

He would’ve been a sophomore At Mississippi State
 
I have a few friends that majored in Agronomy and Soils, one ended up in golf and the other has been working in professional baseball for quite some time. Both have been quite successful with their careers. It can be a financially attractive field to get in to, and it is also a highly competitive field.
 
What “other opportunities”? I did it for about 10 years. Be prepared to not know Saturday from Monday, be up early, and work from a barn. Did I like it? Yes, some of the best years of my career. That said, it can make starting a family tough.

Word of advice, go big early and get into the TPC network.
 
War Eagle said:
I have a few friends that majored in Agronomy and Soils, one ended up in golf and the other has been working in professional baseball for quite some time. Both have been quite successful with their careers. It can be a financially attractive field to get in to, and it is also a highly competitive field.
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He loves golf.And anything is better than making peanuts working in a golf pro shop.We told him use his intelligence and go for the money
 
Slot708 said:
My nephew was a straight A student at Mississippi State in their business program.Which specialized in the Golf Course Management program to become a PGA pro at a course.We had a sit down with the family and convinced him working in a pro shop is a dead end deal.He loves golf and was admitted into the agronomy program at another university.Was this wise of us getting him to convert?Hope we didn’t over step our boundaries.But seems like being a greens keeper would allow more opportunities than a pro shop manager,assistant golf pro

He would’ve been a sophomore At Mississippi State
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I mean if he's getting the degree in business specializing in golf then I would think the long term plan would be more to be the Director of Golf at a high end club or General Manager and some of them can do pretty well. He would definitely get more social/customer service skills in the pro shop. I mowed yards in high school and originally went for a degree in Turfgrass Management. I quickly realized that I didn't really like classes on Plant Genetics and Plant and Soil Science. I switched to Restaurant, Hotel, and Institutional Management with the idea that I'd rather run a country club than take care of a country club. I ended up switching careers out of my major as I later learned I'd rather be a member at a country club.

As Bosco mentioned, hours as a greenskeeper are not great. I rarely see our greenskeeper play. Our pro on the other hand played a couple times a week. I also know many guys who worked in the proshops, were assistant pros or even head pros that then transferred into other careers. Sometimes you can have a member that likes you and has a business or company that they think you might be a good fit so job opportunities could come from that. You aren't probably meeting many people as the greenskeeper.
Parrot said:
If it got him out of Starkville, that ain't all bad. :cool: Kidding, a bit.
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But Mossy Oak is nearby!
 
Slot708 said:
He loves golf.And anything is better than making peanuts working in a golf pro shop.We told him use his intelligence and go for the money
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You don't always make peanuts. I don't know what a head pro at a prestigious course makes, but my guess it's $125+ for many nice courses, and $250k+ for the really top-end private ones. And of course teaching is always an option. Do the math on a pro teaching an average of 5 lessons a day for 5 days a week at $150 an hour and I think you'll be surprised. And of course top coaches command a LOT more per hour. Obviously you have to work your way up there too, but the only thing between a teaching pro and a large salary is the number of hours they're willing to work and whether their work is good enough to establish a name for themselves.

That said, I'm sure there's lots of great opportunities for superintendents too. I don't know what they make but I would imagine it's 150k or more at nicer clubs. But the reality is, the front-of-house-staff (pros) are likely going to make more than back-of-house-staff (maintenance crew). Front-of-house folks might also land a job with manufacturer if that interests them. A superintendent could find themselves working as a general manager of a club at some point, or perhaps working in the USGA research department.

He REALLY needs to think about what is going to bring him more joy regardless of the money. Is he a people person? Does he think he'll enjoy getting his hands dirty more?
 
I'd offer that depending on his personality would be best pursuit of career path. If he's personable in Golf Shop probably better. If more introverted agronomy may be best. Either way there are many ways to have a great career in either.
 
wadesworld said:
You don't always make peanuts. I don't know what a head pro at a prestigious course makes, but my guess it's $125+ for many nice courses, and $250k+ for the really top-end private ones. And of course teaching is always an option. Do the math on a pro teaching an average of 5 lessons a day for 5 days a week at $150 an hour and I think you'll be surprised. And of course top coaches command a LOT more per hour. Obviously you have to work your way up there too, but the only thing between a teaching pro and a large salary is the number of hours they're willing to work and whether their work is good enough to establish a name for themselves.

That said, I'm sure there's lots of great opportunities for superintendents too. I don't know what they make but I would imagine it's 150k or more at nicer clubs. But the reality is, the front-of-house-staff (pros) are likely going to make more than back-of-house-staff (maintenance crew). Front-of-house folks might also land a job with manufacturer if that interests them. A superintendent could find themselves working as a general manager of a club at some point, or perhaps working in the USGA research department.

He REALLY needs to think about what is going to bring him more joy regardless of the money. Is he a people person? Does he think he'll enjoy getting his hands dirty more?
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I think your numbers are for top rated courses. What I saw was assistant pga pros who completed their class work make $15-$17 an hour.Many are salary and have no to little insurance of any kind.The head golf pro is a average salary of $50-$70 k.These are Illinois numbers albeit.But a salary that makes it very difficult to financially make it.I get it, it’s the love of the game for many.And many a club we play at even went away from the PGA presence in the pro shop.And just have college help as shop managers with little to no golf background.
 
There’s assistant superintendents barely making 50K, but it all depends where. You just gotta love it.

I will say that some of that absolute worst employees I ever had were “passionate” about golf and some of the best never touched a club.

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Slot708 said:
I think your numbers are for top rated courses. What I saw was assistant pga pros who completed their class work make $15-$17 an hour.Many are salary and have no to little insurance of any kind.The head golf pro is a average salary of $50-$70 k.These are Illinois numbers albeit.But a salary that makes it very difficult to financially make it.I get it, it’s the love of the game for many.And many a club we play at even went away from the PGA presence in the pro shop.And just have college help as shop managers with little to no golf background.
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Not trying to be rude, but $50-70k a year is not financially difficult to make it on.

Let the kid pursue his dream. If my nephew wanted to be a PGA pro and run a golf shop or even a local muni, let him go with it. Just like any other field, you’re going to have to start towards the bottom, but with a degree it will help him move up the ladder faster. I know if it were me, I’d rather be in the pro shop over repairing greens any day of the week.
 
Slot708 said:
I think your numbers are for top rated courses. What I saw was assistant pga pros who completed their class work make $15-$17 an hour.Many are salary and have no to little insurance of any kind.The head golf pro is a average salary of $50-$70 k.These are Illinois numbers albeit.But a salary that makes it very difficult to financially make it.I get it, it’s the love of the game for many.And many a club we play at even went away from the PGA presence in the pro shop.And just have college help as shop managers with little to no golf background.
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Yeah, not saying he won't have to move to get to the best markets and it won't be a grind to get to the top. That's going to be true of either path. He's going to have to drive a crappy (paid for) car for a while, live in a relatively crappy apartment probably with a roommate or two, and his entertainment is going to consist of chipping and putting. But again, that's likely true regardless of path.

Best thing he can do for either path is to endear himself to others. It's often a mentor that moves to another course to become the GM that recommends you come along as the head pro, or the superintendent that leaves for a swankier course that recommends you take over as the super of your current course.
 
Slot708 said:
I think your numbers are for top rated courses. What I saw was assistant pga pros who completed their class work make $15-$17 an hour.Many are salary and have no to little insurance of any kind.The head golf pro is a average salary of $50-$70 k.These are Illinois numbers albeit.But a salary that makes it very difficult to financially make it.I get it, it’s the love of the game for many.And many a club we play at even went away from the PGA presence in the pro shop.And just have college help as shop managers with little to no golf background.
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One can now get a job here in So Cal for $20 bucks an hour to flip burgers, and I don’t believe it takes a college education to do it. Not 100% sure, so don’t quote me on that.

PGA this or PGA that title doesn’t seem to carry much weight for all but the top 1% or less. Perhaps Phil was right in more ways than most folks think?
 
It had a lot to do with his golf playing ability as well.He shoots 80-90, which he was told may be a problem passing his PAT.(Player Ability Test).Didn’t know you had to shoot like a tour pro to sell golf gloves and tees.But what do I know

$50 to $70k is struggling if your trying to have.Or have a family in todays world
 
Slot708 said:
He loves golf.And anything is better than making peanuts working in a golf pro shop.We told him use his intelligence and go for the money
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Yeah, it's a lot of hours, but I don't think he would be working exclusively in the pro shop. Our pros not only order/stock the pro shop, but give lessons, run tournaments and clinics, etc.
 
Nice 2 said:
PGA this or PGA that title doesn’t seem to carry much weight for all but the top 1% or less. Perhaps Phil was right in more ways than most folks think?
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PGA Tour or LIV profits have nothing to do with what a club pro is paid. No matter what their profits are, it's not going to clubs except those that host events.

Bottom-line is that golf is a very tough business and profit margins are small.
 
Wherever he ends up, I don’t believe he’ll be “stuck” in any avenue, as long as he’s got the hustle. The free golf and shirts fades pretty quick and lots of days the last place you want to play is your own track. You can only be “on” so much. I worked at a TPC course that I could play whenever but sometimes chose a goat track as my get-away course when I just wanted to relax and play golf.
 
Slot708 said:
It had a lot to do with his golf playing ability as well.He shoots 80-90, which he was told may be a problem passing his PAT.(Player Ability Test).Didn’t know you had to shoot like a tour pro to sell golf gloves and tees.But what do I know

$50 to $70k is struggling if your trying to have.Or have a family in todays world
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Has he had lessons and is still shooting 80-90? If he's never had lessons then at his age he should be able to get some and really lower that. As part of the training he will be learning about the golf swing and how to teach it and will learn/know what to work on. This is in addition to having a Pro there that should be able to also help him. I would think as long as he works at it and practices he should be able to pass the PAT. I have a friend who was one of our assistant pros and he would go out 2-3 times a day to the range for 15-30 minutes to practice and work on his game to get ready for it.
 
Slot708 said:
It had a lot to do with his golf playing ability as well.He shoots 80-90, which he was told may be a problem passing his PAT.(Player Ability Test).Didn’t know you had to shoot like a tour pro to sell golf gloves and tees.But what do I know

$50 to $70k is struggling if your trying to have.Or have a family in todays world
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If he shoots closer to 80 it might be doable on a good day. It's impossible closer to 90. The PAT is the course rating + 15 strokes over 36 holes in one day. So if the course rating is 72, you need a 36 hole score of 159, which means 2 rounds of 80 won't get it done. But you're also not doing the PAT to be a full PGA Pro to sell tees. You're giving lessons as well.

You can't make blanket statements saying 50 to 70K is struggling as there are so many factors like location and your partners income to factor in.
 
There are a lot of other occupations he could get into in the Golf Industry. Like most things, pay your dues, work hard, network and be ready for other opportunities. Once knew a sales rep with a major golf company who loved his job.

Good Golfing
 
My main reaction is that managing a retail operation and being an agronomist are so massively different areas of interest that there is no way anyone would make that change, but for the unifying theme of golf. In other words, the odds of him being passionate about agronomy are probably zero. Passion > hard work are what leads to long successful careers. Put this all together and I think you approached this the wrong way. Maybe he should have changed, but not because he’d only make X doing the pro shop gig.
 
Based on my limited knowledge I’d say it was a good move. Can do more with it too outside of golf. I’ve known a few people who tried to go the PGA pro route and said it just wasn’t worth it
 
A friend of mine took courses at Virginia Tech in Turfgrass Management. He has worked at Pinehurst amongst other places. Got hired on as superintendent at a course in Charlotte, NC. He even met Michael Jordan a few times. Later on, that course was going downhill, cutting costs, not paying on time, etc. The owner of a golf course equipment sales place came in and said, "I know you didn't go to college to sell golf course equipment. However, come work for me, and you won't regret it." So, he did. Hasn't looked back. Makes six figures and based on sales, has been to Germany a few times as comp trips, deep sea fished off the coast of San Diego, and even played the Old Course. So many avenues in the golf industry. I tell my son who is 17: Find a job path you like a lot/love, and it won't seem like work. Because could you imagine going to a job you absolutely hate for the next 35-45 years?
 
collegefbfan said:
A friend of mine took courses at Virginia Tech in Turfgrass Management. He has worked at Pinehurst amongst other places. Got hired on as superintendent at a course in Charlotte, NC. He even met Michael Jordan a few times. Later on, that course was going downhill, cutting costs, not paying on time, etc. The owner of a golf course equipment sales place came in and said, "I know you didn't go to college to sell golf course equipment. However, come work for me, and you won't regret it." So, he did. Hasn't looked back. Makes six figures and based on sales, has been to Germany a few times as comp trips, deep sea fished off the coast of San Diego, and even played the Old Course. So many avenues in the golf industry. I tell my son who is 17: Find a job path you like a lot/love, and it won't seem like work. Because could you imagine going to a job you absolutely hate for the next 35-45 years?
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It’s all about connections. But working in a pro shop for$17 is a slap in the face after a college degree. And some have been in that shop for a long long time making that after college. Yes, love of the game. I get it. But comes a point where love of the game versus having a nice life for you and a family
 
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