Drills to prevent taking club outside on backswing

[annsguy]

I tend to get the club outside on the takeaway. Yesterday I was so outside i was hitting the bucket of balls that was right of my set up position. I somehow re-route this mistake which produces a draw but its terrible. I was told my hands move out as i start the swing. Any ideas or drills.

 

[Arlo]

Gerry Hogan, author of The Hogan Manual of Human Performance: GOLF, 1991
wrote to aim a fart behind your left heel (right hand swinger) before taking the BS.
That will get you started with the clubhead moving gradually inside.
Your intent from the top is to SLIDE the face of the golfclub under the inside of the ball.(inside quadrant)

Tee the ball a bit and try it. Dont think about it, just do it.

 

[Turtlerancher]

I tend to get the club outside on the takeaway. Yesterday I was so outside i was hitting the bucket of balls that was right of my set up position. I somehow re-route this mistake which produces a draw but its terrible. I was told my hands move out as i start the swing. Any ideas or drills.

What works for me is a one piece takeaway where my hands do nothing until they pass my right leg. From there my instructor has me start my wrist and arm movement. YMMV

 

[annsguy]

Gerry Hogan, author of The Hogan Manual of Human Performance: GOLF, 1991
wrote to aim a fart behind your left heel (right hand swinger) before taking the BS.
That will get you started with the clubhead moving gradually inside.
Your intent from the top is to SLIDE the face of the golfclub under the inside of the ball.(inside quadrant)

Tee the ball a bit and try it. Dont think about it, just do it.

Aim a what?

 

[Nick20UK]

What works for me is a one piece takeaway where my hands do nothing until they pass my right leg. From there my instructor has me start my wrist and arm movement. YMMV

This. Start with your shoulders turning not your hands.

 

[Arlo]

This. Start with your shoulders turning not your hands.

Elevate the left shoulder an inch toward the left ear, then start BS.
Another break through by Gerry Hogan, The Hogan Manual of Human Performance: GOLF, 1991.

Watch Moe Norman did the same.

Elevating the left shoulder for right hand swinger will engage he collar bone(clavicle) to lock with torso.
ie when you turn in BS, scapula and arm will move away together with the spine and pelvic basin (they are attached)
Without elevating the left shoulder toward left ear, the left shoulder will be able to move independent of the spine and pelvic basin and you then may need gimmicks such as video by Morikawa .

 

[razaar]

Look up You-tube video - Colin Morikawa explains how to keep your hands and body in sync.
It is an oldie but a goodie.

 

[Desmond]

I tend to get the club outside on the takeaway. Yesterday I was so outside i was hitting the bucket of balls that was right of my set up position. I somehow re-route this mistake which produces a draw but its terrible. I was told my hands move out as i start the swing. Any ideas or drills.

Welcome, Brother, to my world. When I restarted the game in 1995, I took lessons, and through video, I saw that I was doing the same thing. Asked them to help me with it and the Hank Haney instructors said don't worry about it. But I did.

Started working on it about 5 yrs ago, but it is heck to get rid of it. Although it's better.

You've got to feel as if your lead upper arm stays on your chest as you go to parallel on the backswing, and then keep on going inside from there.

Helps if you start turning your body, arms are more passive at start so lead arm stays more on chest.

As your hands (for a righty) go past your right pocket, brush the pocket (hands in, but the clubhead is outside the hands)

Have a friend hold a pool noodle so if you go outside, you hit the noodle.

As you get to parallel, you should see that your shaft looks steep - more straight up and down, before it shallows at the top.

Feel as if the clubhead is looking at you as you take the backswing - don't bend your wrists back or lead arm will come off your chest.

I also try to see if I can think of my trail shoulder turning higher at the start.

Put a glove or towel under your lead arm pit and keep it there.

I'll see if I can find some vids ... as someone mentioned, Colin Morikawa vids. Vid doesn't show - just click where it says view on youtube.

 

[DNice26]

Any chance you have a video from down the line? Perhaps you think this is a problem, but it really isn't?

 

[Xt1ncT-NZ]

This. I used to think it was a major issue but the guy who I get lessons from says there are much worse things.
It also depends on how much outside.
Also- it may just be you thinking you do it but don’t.

 

[YukonLiving]

Some very good advice here.

I also picked up a swing drill where you put your back leg behind your usual stance, so you’re placing most of your weight on the front leg. The foot of your back leg is on your tip toes. Almost looks like you’re walking and you’ve just taken a step with your front leg and are about to bring your back leg up for the next.

This is supposed to help with promoting a more in to out path on downswing, but I find it helps with my takeaway feeling as well.

 

[Phil75070]

Years and years ago, my wife got me a Christmas present, a one-hour lesson with Hank Haney, yes, the Hank Haney. He looked at my swing and told me I was taking the club too far back on the inside. He told me that the typical result is to hit your irons fat, unless you are a somewhat better golfer and are able to get your weight well over to the left side.

What does this have to do with an outside takeaway? He videotaped both my "before" swing and after he had me doing what he wanted me to do. Watching the "after" he asked me if I noticed any difference. I told him it now looks like I am taking the club back to the outside. He literally exploded! He said, why is it someone can yank the club straight back to the inside and no-one will say a thing, but take it back to the outside even the slightest will be frowned upon. Starting back slightly to the outside is not a bad thing, it is a matter of degree.

 

[razaar]

When I changed my swing yonks ago, I used a mini power band to trap my right elbow In front of my hip at address. The drill is to make the left hand / arm control the takeaway and upswing and to train the right arm to be there to help brace the left but not do its work. I started taking the club back to first parallel (shaft) and hitting chip shots. Then advanced gradually until I could swing trussed up like this with left arm parallel. This drill really made me turn during the backswing and use back muscles that I had never used before in body rotation. I got to the stage where I could hit 3/4 mid iron shots with the band on. When the band comes off golf shots feel weird with the right arm that has its freedom. It still wants to get involved when it shouldn't but I now know the feel of keeping it in check.

 

[Vader]

Get a smart ball, or find something like it. Results will be immediate.

 

[Desmond]

Years and years ago, my wife got me a Christmas present, a one-hour lesson with Hank Haney, yes, the Hank Haney. He looked at my swing and told me I was taking the club too far back on the inside. He told me that the typical result is to hit your irons fat, unless you are a somewhat better golfer and are able to get your weight well over to the left side.

What does this have to do with an outside takeaway? He videotaped both my "before" swing and after he had me doing what he wanted me to do. Watching the "after" he asked me if I noticed any difference. I told him it now looks like I am taking the club back to the outside. He literally exploded! He said, why is it someone can yank the club straight back to the inside and no-one will say a thing, but take it back to the outside even the slightest will be frowned upon. Starting back slightly to the outside is not a bad thing, it is a matter of degree.

Threadjack Warning - just ignore.

Haney's method of instruction appeared to allow mid to high cappers to hit a draw. His instructors at that time did not say much, they'd just pull and tug your body where they wanted it.

I have no idea what he did with golfers who already had a swing other than I would see him write down a laundry list of things to improve.

They had me taking it so outside and doing nothing about it that it has taken me over a decade to get most of it out of the way. Haney had a golf ranch around what is now TPC Craig Ranch north of Dallas. In Big D, I'd go into a golf store, and hear people talk about how Haney ruined their swing... frequently. I finally understood after a few years. I would ask their instructors some questions about his swing and what he was doing with Tiger, and they had no idea. I think Tiger was teaching Hank. Hank was probably telling Tiger what he saw.

 

[Hitsnmisses]

Elevate the left shoulder an inch toward the left ear, then start BS.
Another break through by Gerry Hogan, The Hogan Manual of Human Performance: GOLF, 1991.

Watch Moe Norman did the same.

Elevating the left shoulder for right hand swinger will engage he collar bone(clavicle) to lock with torso.
ie when you turn in BS, scapula and arm will move away together with the spine and pelvic basin (they are attached)
Without elevating the left shoulder toward left ear, the left shoulder will be able to move independent of the spine and pelvic basin and you then may need gimmicks such as video by Morikawa .

I understand the description , but isn’t it a common comment that Morikowa, shot dispersion , with his 6 iron is as good as any contemporay with a pitching wedge ?which would indicate more accurately swing efficacy and accuracy ? And his results are quite staggering with reference to his age ?

 

[Turtlerancher]

I understand the description , but isn’t it a common comment that Morikowa, shot dispersion , with his 6 iron is as good as any contemporay with a pitching wedge ?which would indicate more accurately swing efficacy and accuracy ? And his results are quite staggering with reference to his age ?

I stayed away from that one with a ten foot pole. Morikowa is likely in the top 5 on Tour in ball striking.

 

[Hitsnmisses]

I stayed away from that one with a ten foot pole. Morikowa is likely in the top 5 on Tour in ball striking.

I would need a 10 foot club to hit anywhere near him lol he is a stunning player , amongst many others at that level

 

[Phil75070]

They had me taking it so outside

"A major fault of both accomplished and recreational golfers alike is taking the club too far inside on the backswing. This inside position generally leads to the club getting stuck behind the right hip (for right-handed golfers) on the downswing, preventing the desired, down-the-line release. "

For someone who takes the club back too far inside, you do understand how the use of exaggeration in teaching might be used to correct that? That is what I got from that lesson.

 

[Desmond]

"A major fault of both accomplished and recreational golfers alike is taking the club too far inside on the backswing. This inside position generally leads to the club getting stuck behind the right hip (for right-handed golfers) on the downswing, preventing the desired, down-the-line release. "

For someone who takes the club back too far inside, you do understand how the use of exaggeration in teaching might be used to correct that? That is what I got from that lesson.

I've had more golf lessons - and bad golf lessons - than the average bear A lot more.

Hank Haney's people, Chris 'Swing Left 'O'Connell...

After a period of time, I'd ask - you are teaching the exaggeration, right?

My problem with swing left, taking it outside, inside, exaggerations and instructors, is that they are not transparent with students or they do not know how to explain the techniques they are supposedly teaching.

Most instruction sucks - that's a general statement - and from what I've heard on the range from instructors, it is better now than 20 and 10 years ago. It is evolving to decent. But I still hear 'swing left.'

Okay, what the hell does that mean? Tell the student how to swing left. Tell the student about the arms-body connection, sequencing and how ...

Like I said, a lot of instruction sucks.

And when you say, people take it inside too much, how are they taking it inside? arms, taking the club off their chest, etc.

It's all in the details. Explain the general idea, why, and get to the physical movements that get you swinging left (as an example) or how to take the club back correctly, and then drills for their particular issue.

 

[Carolina Golfer]

Elevate the left shoulder an inch toward the left ear, then start BS.
Another break through by Gerry Hogan, The Hogan Manual of Human Performance: GOLF, 1991.

Watch Moe Norman did the same.

Elevating the left shoulder for right hand swinger will engage he collar bone(clavicle) to lock with torso.
ie when you turn in BS, scapula and arm will move away together with the spine and pelvic basin (they are attached)
Without elevating the left shoulder toward left ear, the left shoulder will be able to move independent of the spine and pelvic basin and you then may need gimmicks such as video by Morikawa .

Thought you guys would enjoy a thread from Gerry himself.

Ask Gerry Hogan... - Golf Instruction

Page 1 of 8 - Ask Gerry Hogan... - posted in Golf Instruction: Ok Ill get this rolling, and I hope its in the right forum...Gerry Hogan recently popped onto Lags thread and introduced himself. He wrote a Manual called The Hogan Manual of Human Performance GOLF which some ISGers remember. If I...

forums.iseekgolf.com

 

[Desmond]

Thought you guys would enjoy a thread from Gerry himself.

Ask Gerry Hogan... - Golf Instruction

Page 1 of 8 - Ask Gerry Hogan... - posted in Golf Instruction: Ok Ill get this rolling, and I hope its in the right forum...Gerry Hogan recently popped onto Lags thread and introduced himself. He wrote a Manual called The Hogan Manual of Human Performance GOLF which some ISGers remember. If I...

forums.iseekgolf.com

Thx. I read his first 4 posts - other than we are full of levers and we can't push, we pull, and work together, it was a lot of verbiage saying little -- lol -- like many posts in the Swing Thoughts thread. After a shot of tequila, I will read more.

 

[Phil75070]

Most instruction sucks

lot of instruction sucks

Totally agree. I've only had one lesson out of many, and it wasn't even really a lesson but during a swing evaluation where I got a tip or two, where the instructor didn't have some swing theory or swing model that he was trying to make my swing into. Few instructors have the ability to look at one's swing and just make a tweak here or there that will help us improve. That's all we want, to improve. Very few of us are looking to rise to the upper echelons of amateur golf or turn pro so we don't need perfect swings. Besides, there are all sorts of strange/different swings out on tour that have had tremendous success. John Rahm and JB Holmes with really short backswings; Furyk and Wolff who start the club back way outside......You don't have to have a "pretty" golf swing like Adam Scott to play good golf.

 

[Desmond]

Totally agree. I've only had one lesson out of many, and it wasn't even really a lesson but during a swing evaluation where I go a tip or two, where the instructor didn't have some swing theory or swing model that he was trying to make my swing into. Few instructors have the ability to look at one's swing and just make a tweak here or there that will help us improve. That's all we want, to improve. Very few of us are looking to rise to the upper echelons of amateur golf or turn pro so we don't need perfect swings. Besides, there are all sorts of strange/different swings out on tour that have had tremendous success. John Rahm and JB Holmes with really short backswings; Furyk and Wolff who start the club back way outside......You don't have to havea "pretty" golf swing like Adam Scott to play good golf.

I seem to like the "suck" word. But that's a polite way of discussing instruction. I usually stuck with an instructor for at least 4 lessons because I did not know better, usually longer, because as I said, I was ignorant.

I've stayed with one instructor, except for an outside instructor for putting, for 3 years because he helped with my issues, which were many after 15 yrs of poor instruction/explanation and feeling forced to look at YouTube to get more, which led to more issues. My current instructor still says things like "swing left" but I've asked him how. When he says "swing faster," I say show and tell me the technique to swing faster. I still dig some of it out of the ground myself but he helps with mental prep and on course play, too. You then begin to diagnose your own issues after time - like the current one - I started digging, which I do not do - which told me - "you're coming in too steep - shallow it out" and I know how to shallow.

 

[pattyboy21]

Without reading the responses above (maybe someone suggested this), a good drill is to set up and place a golf ball just behind your club. The goal is to push the golf ball straight back on the takeaway - this promotes a good path, but it also promotes a smooth start to the swing as you want to simply roll the ball back gently, not fling it back violently.