Damaikis
Fairway Finder
Yeah. I spend 100% of my money, disposable or not, on golf. Being on THP all the time isn't helping.
What is wrong with Golf Courses?
Yeah. I spend 100% of my money, disposable or not, on golf. Being on THP all the time isn't helping.
LeftySean
Active member
What is wrong with golf courses?
I'll go against the grain here, and suggest that traditional course marshalls are a sure fire way to chase casual golfers away. If I haven't played in a couple of years, I'm going to hit many bad shots, and the last thing I need is to be barked at about playing too slow. So, if a course is going to let beginners and high handicappers on in the first place, then they should tell the rest of the golfers to be patient. If a group of hackers is slowing things down by means other than poor play (ball hawking, chit-chatting, impromptu lessons, etc.) then that would warrant some intervention, but that would also require course marshalls to actually pay attention and exercise some judgement. However, In my experience, course marshalls never make the effort to distinguish between groups playing slow due lack of ability, versus lack of etiquette. In fact, in my experience, course marshalls never make the effort to distinguish between slow groups and fast groups - they just harangue every group that passes by. Maybe it's a Saskatchewan thing...
Anyway, other things golf courses need to consider:
Cut back the bushes/trees
Keep the rough a bit shorter
eliminate blind shots
eliminate forced carries
blah blah blah blah - I guess what I'm saying is make the courses easier to play. This will irk the better golfers, but let's face it, better golfers are in the minority, and it's the disposable income of 15-20 million casual golfers that appears to be at stake here - if all of that casual money goes away for good, we'll end up with a few thousand fewer courses to play at.
One idea that I would like to add my voice to: the 6/9/12/18 hole option. Let golfers pay for just 6, 9, or 12 - That sounds like a great way to tackle the affordability issue and the time issue. There's a couple of problems here - ensuring golfers leave the course after the allotted number. That, and many courses are not set up in a way that golfers could easily return to the club house from the 6th or 12th holes. But it's an idea worth looking into.
I'll go against the grain here, and suggest that traditional course marshalls are a sure fire way to chase casual golfers away. If I haven't played in a couple of years, I'm going to hit many bad shots, and the last thing I need is to be barked at about playing too slow. So, if a course is going to let beginners and high handicappers on in the first place, then they should tell the rest of the golfers to be patient. If a group of hackers is slowing things down by means other than poor play (ball hawking, chit-chatting, impromptu lessons, etc.) then that would warrant some intervention, but that would also require course marshalls to actually pay attention and exercise some judgement. However, In my experience, course marshalls never make the effort to distinguish between groups playing slow due lack of ability, versus lack of etiquette. In fact, in my experience, course marshalls never make the effort to distinguish between slow groups and fast groups - they just harangue every group that passes by. Maybe it's a Saskatchewan thing...
Anyway, other things golf courses need to consider:
Cut back the bushes/trees
Keep the rough a bit shorter
eliminate blind shots
eliminate forced carries
blah blah blah blah - I guess what I'm saying is make the courses easier to play. This will irk the better golfers, but let's face it, better golfers are in the minority, and it's the disposable income of 15-20 million casual golfers that appears to be at stake here - if all of that casual money goes away for good, we'll end up with a few thousand fewer courses to play at.
One idea that I would like to add my voice to: the 6/9/12/18 hole option. Let golfers pay for just 6, 9, or 12 - That sounds like a great way to tackle the affordability issue and the time issue. There's a couple of problems here - ensuring golfers leave the course after the allotted number. That, and many courses are not set up in a way that golfers could easily return to the club house from the 6th or 12th holes. But it's an idea worth looking into.
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Agreed 10000000 %
I see too many egos out there at the back tees that can't hit it out of the shadow of the forward tees.
bakb
New member
do you remember the Hank Haney show where it showed kids from his school? Half those kids on that show were garbage. I remember one girl on there who's best round ever was 103. WTF why do they get to play on the premier junior tour and get exposure. I only remember one really good golfer at that HS she was a girl who went to Georgia. The rest paid 60k a year and weren't that great but because they were rich they will likely play college somewhere.
Yet me and my buddies have to go to a JC to get noticed even though we score better and are better players just because we don't have the funds to play on a decent junior tour. (even though we both made it to state and scored near par almost all season)
wull
New member
for the sake of slow play i like the idea of having the rough cut to a height that makes it much easier to find your ball.i played 54 holes at crieff golf club in competition this year and i never lost a ball,which for me at the time was very rare.reason being the rough is at the perfect level,if you hit it wayward you will find your ball but you get punished with maybe a tree in the way......but the + side is you aren't wasting 5 mins looking for the ball.
i've only had one incident with slow play this year and it was a real pain in the butt,the guy wouldn't let us through and it took us 2 hrs to play 6 holes.
i've only had one incident with slow play this year and it was a real pain in the butt,the guy wouldn't let us through and it took us 2 hrs to play 6 holes.
Bomb_n_Gouge
New member
Just reading through this since my last post yesterday and I noticed a lot of talk still about things being too expensive. I wonder if they have thought about the people who have not come to the game of golf with a silver spoon in their mouth. Angel Cabrera has a green jacket and Lee Trevino has 2 US opens 2 British opens and 2 PGA championships, even Tiger Woods didn't grow up "rich". Basically if you want something bad enough you will find a way to do it. Watch the Big Break and learn the stories of these guys and girls who work jobs just to pay their entry fees into tournaments. Money doesn't buy you talent and if you think you are that good then find a way to go out and prove it.
As far as the game being relatable to teenagers, I think every generation has their professional golf that can look up to. Growing up I had Tiger to watch as he was working his way on to the tour, right now Rickie Fowler and Bubba Watson are probably the most relatable to the younger crowd. I picked up the game at 12 with an ancient set of clubs, a 50lb hand me down bag and whatever golf balls my dad didn't want. I wouldn't play the nicest courses, in fact I would play the cheapest or sneak on and carry the heaviest bag you've ever seen. I practiced in my front yard and at the elementary school yard by my house everyday in order to make my schools golf team. My friends didn't pick up the game until college and by then I could not only beat all of them I could help them learn the game the way I did, if they had a passion for it then they work on it the way I did. The people that angered me the most were the ones who weren't great at golf right away and gave up on it, and in my opinion golf doesn't need them.
As far as the game being relatable to teenagers, I think every generation has their professional golf that can look up to. Growing up I had Tiger to watch as he was working his way on to the tour, right now Rickie Fowler and Bubba Watson are probably the most relatable to the younger crowd. I picked up the game at 12 with an ancient set of clubs, a 50lb hand me down bag and whatever golf balls my dad didn't want. I wouldn't play the nicest courses, in fact I would play the cheapest or sneak on and carry the heaviest bag you've ever seen. I practiced in my front yard and at the elementary school yard by my house everyday in order to make my schools golf team. My friends didn't pick up the game until college and by then I could not only beat all of them I could help them learn the game the way I did, if they had a passion for it then they work on it the way I did. The people that angered me the most were the ones who weren't great at golf right away and gave up on it, and in my opinion golf doesn't need them.
Esox
New member
The girl that went to Georgia was from Spain and was one of the finest junior girl golfers in the world at that time. There were also other fine players on that show. While those kids were playing those events in the Carolinas, that was tour anyone could play that was associated with those golf academies. While those kids are allowed to attempt to play the AJGA if they pay their fees, if they don't score they don't make it past the first qualifying round. In your attempt to get noticed, did you send videos of your swing and info about yourself and your game to college coaches where you were interested in playing? Did you do research and understand the recruiting process? There is more than one way to get noticed by college coaches than playing the expensive tournaments, though that certainly does help. There's a ton of info available pertaining to college golf recruiting. You have to find it.
Golf is no different than many things in life. Those with money can have an advantage. Those that don't need to work harder and go about their business differently to get where they want to go. No one is entitled to anything. Doesn't the State of Indiana have a state golf association? Here in WI the WSGA hosts a plethora of multi-day events that are reasonably priced. State Open, State Match Play, State Amateur to name a few. The State PGA hosts three to four one day events every single week that are affordable. You need to find a way to get noticed. Play in what you can afford. Find a place for yourself. Complaining about rich kids is going to fall on deaf ears with college coaches. While they certainly do spend a fair amount of time recruiting based on the tours you can't afford to play, they do not ignore possible good players making their way in different ways. Such players may need to fight to get noticed, though, no doubt about that.
I will say that since I have a daughter, I know it is much easier for females to get noticed. The quality of the play in junior boys golf is much greater. Consequently, so is the competition for scholarships and spots on college teams. A school like Georgia is going to have their pick of the junior golfer crop. My daughter is only 14, but one thing I've already learned while researching college recruiting is you have to set reasonable expectations. My wife, daughter, and I have the goal of getting her a quality education. Big school, small school, good golf team, bad golf team: we'll consider most anything when the time comes.
I took this thread a little off topic. Sorry.
Kevin
Smallville
#ICanHitADraw
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Me too Hawk. I can't recall ever having a putt for eagle.Hahaha. For me, it's a three shot hole no matter what. I don't think I've ever gone for a par 5 in two in my life
I won't even get into this because a discussion on this would be better suited for the debate room.
TC
Keg Thrower
Ok, some good stuff in here. I agree with Esox, you can't expect to get noticed. You may have to do some "blue" collar work to put yourself in front of colleges, rather than spending a ton of money to play in tournaments where those same coaches are. Take some initiative. I sent tons of tape to colleges when I was playing High School baseball. No one came to recruit me, b/c I went to a smaller school. Life isn't fair, get use to it.
As far as making golf courses easier, I disagree. Leave them how they are. People should practice more before they get out on the course and spend the bulk of their time ball hawking. I never stepped foot on a nice course until I felt I was capable enough to break 100. I played on par 3 courses or dirt tracks until I could comfortable manage my way around.
As far as making golf courses easier, I disagree. Leave them how they are. People should practice more before they get out on the course and spend the bulk of their time ball hawking. I never stepped foot on a nice course until I felt I was capable enough to break 100. I played on par 3 courses or dirt tracks until I could comfortable manage my way around.
pjcedog
New member
I was told the other day that I was 'cheating' playing the front tees because I was hitting the ball too far. Can't make everyone happy either way.
Esox
New member
Sending tape is huge in golf. There are tons of recruiting sites that will tell you exactly what to do. For free. But you have to set realistic expectations. Unless Gracie suddenly blossoms into a world class player, there's no way she's going to Stanford, or Duke, or Georgia, or even WI. But every year there are two handfuls of grils from WI that get nice money to play at schools like Butler, Drake, a number IL schools, etc. in Divison 1. And there is tons of Division 2 money available for girls both for golf and academically.
And again, I understand it is much harder for boys. But life in general can be kind of a pain in the ass.
Kevin
RonInThornton
LEFTIES UNITE!!!
Why is that wrong? His parents must have spent time and MONEY to become educated enough to earn a well off lifestyle. Why would it be wrong that they choose to have their offspring benefit from it?
I know a girl that just turned 14. Her family has no money. Her father is her instructor. She's a true golfing phenom and works very hard at the game. She'll have no problem getting a D1 scholarship. She's won a ton of regional tournaments and a few national ones. I watched her play last Saturday. It was cold, the wind was howling, the rain was falling sideways, and she shot a 75 on a very tough course. She won that tournament (third year in a row). A couple weeks before that she won a tournament at Bethpage by, I think it was seven shots (beating girls four years older in both tournaments). You don't have to come from money to "make it".
RonInThornton
LEFTIES UNITE!!!
I like the idea of "Suggested" Tee boxes appropriate for your handicap, a lot of beginning players simply don't know where to play from. When I started playing last year none of my friends or brother in laws suggested I play from closer up until I got a grip on the game. Sure as hell wish they would have.
Would like to see less stress placed on balls too. There is absolutely no reason for a high handicapper to be playing a Pro V 1 or a 330, no wonder they spend 10 minutes looking for lost balls. I would too if I were gullible enough to be playing $4 a piece balls. Ball manufacturers or the guys in the Pro shop aren't going to tell them that though
Would like to see less stress placed on balls too. There is absolutely no reason for a high handicapper to be playing a Pro V 1 or a 330, no wonder they spend 10 minutes looking for lost balls. I would too if I were gullible enough to be playing $4 a piece balls. Ball manufacturers or the guys in the Pro shop aren't going to tell them that though
Bomb_n_Gouge
New member
There was the suggestion of golf courses being too expensive and then it spiraled, sorry i am partly to blame in this.
As long as the cost is adjusted properly. It doesn't seem to cost half as much to play 9 as it does to play 18.
bassing33
Member
the biggest deterrent of golf for me has always been the cost. It is an expensive game to play in most places. The only reason I play so much now is it's only $16 to walk 18 holes for both courses in town. I can swing that on a regular basis. I can't pay $30 or $40 very often. prices like that turn me into a once or twice a year golfer.
CharlieMoy
Well-known member
- Thread starter
- #94
That really surprises me based on how much you spend on equipment.
Barberakb
USAF / Go Cowboys!
I wouldn't be golfing every week if I had to shell out $50. I never pay more than $25. I guess military courses have spoiled me.
Divebell
Par is never bad...
Here in south Florida, some of the courses have cleared out some of the dreaded palmetto bushes that line a lot of the courses. If done tastefully, it still looks nice and does not take away from the design, but speeds up play.
The economy has certainly hurt golf. It would be nice if the prices were lowered some, but the courses in the winter months are packed here in south Florida. Courses can almost charge whatever they want, because people pay it and the courses are packed.
The economy has certainly hurt golf. It would be nice if the prices were lowered some, but the courses in the winter months are packed here in south Florida. Courses can almost charge whatever they want, because people pay it and the courses are packed.
Oregon Golfer
#XBomb
Agreed. I also think that while it's great that more and more people are taking up the game of golf, too many have unrealistic expectations and don't realize the commitment needed to play to a decent score. There is also a considereble investment required to play golf. You have to spend at least a couple of hunderd dollars as a start-up for clubs, balls, etc... but also you have to continue to pay green fees and potentially buy additional equipment, (balls, tees...),each time you play. For this investment I think many new players expect to be rewarded with good scores. Also I think it is percieved by the average person that because the courses they are playing look similar to the courses the pros are playing on TV, they can imagine themselves peforming similary. Also because golf is an individual sport you can more easily visualize yourself in the pro's shoes and therefore performing similary.
For a moment compare golf to many other popular sports. Basketball; you can buy a $15 ball at your local variety store, go to your local park or school, and play for free. Because the court you're playing on looks nothing like the mega venues that the NBA plays in you don't have the same expectations of similar performance. Since you're also out out there with 9 other people, referrees, coaches, etc... so you can further distance yourself and your expectations from your game and the game the pros play.
I think similar differences can be taken from other popular sports suc as baseball, football, etc...
Sorry for the long rant, just wanted to get my thoughts out....
lcsmrtn
New member
That's a really good post oregon
buzzd
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nine hole course where I play most summer mornings started a mon-fri membership this year--$355bucks including privileges at CC next door--not a bad price for a 4 morning a week habit!
Oregon Golfer
#XBomb
Wow, that's great! But I'm assuming that in Wisconsin your golf season is approx 6 months?