Having trouble fixing early extension

[GolfLivesMatter]

Agreeing with you. After all the knee is connected to the thigh which is connected to the hip . I’ve tried attacking EE through various body parts (right butt cheek, left cheek, left knee external rotation as you mentioned, squatting down) but none stuck for me. I’m going to try my latest epiphany at the range on Tuesday and video it. So far the swings in my backyard setup has produced good results but I have not hit balls yet so TBD. We all know the longer the club, the more exacerbated the fault is exposed. I can ‘hide’ my EE ok with the short clubs but boy o boy the driver is U G L Y....hide the goats! Below is a vid from yesterday where I focused on the feeling of my hand pushing the left hip back on the downswing. Not too bad but let’s see what happens with a ball there. Fingers crossed.

Again the hip feeling (for me) seems to work and may not for others. Just wanted to share my thoughts.

Looks pretty darn good. I don't know where you started from but certainly you're getting much closer. One thing I found today was this: If I don't make a complete rotational shoulder turn back, and I drive my left knee left, my swing goes wildly OTT. What I mean by rotation back is I can tend to turn my arms to "look like" the club is going back, but my shoulders barely turned. I was wondering why I was shanking a lot of shorter shots. I like to think of having two training sticks on the ground....one at a 45 degree angle for the takeaway, and the other at a 45 degree angle for the follow thru to exit low and left.

 

[tinman143]

Looks pretty darn good. I don't know where you started from but certainly you're getting much closer. One thing I found today was this: If I don't make a complete rotational shoulder turn back, and I drive my left knee left, my swing goes wildly OTT. What I mean by rotation back is I can tend to turn my arms to "look like" the club is going back, but my shoulders barely turned. I was wondering why I was shanking a lot of shorter shots. I like to think of having two training sticks on the ground....one at a 45 degree angle for the takeaway, and the other at a 45 degree angle for the follow thru to exit low and left.

Thanks and can’t wait to take the experiment out to the range. Let’s pray it sticks. I’m not sure it would apply to your OTT but the Russell Heritage video covers some of that in the 2nd drill. OTT isn’t an issue for me (mine’s the opposite and being too far under with too much tilt) so I can really just focus on ingraining drill 1. Anyway drill 2 emphasizes the right elbow tucking in on the DS which helps shallow things.

 

[GolfLivesMatter]

Thanks and can’t wait to take the experiment out to the range. Let’s pray it sticks. I’m not sure it would apply to your OTT but the Russell Heritage video covers some of that in the 2nd drill. OTT isn’t an issue for me (mine’s the opposite and being too far under with too much tilt) so I can really just focus on ingraining drill 1. Anyway drill 2 emphasizes the right elbow tucking in on the DS which helps shallow things.

Yep. My point is that if I don’t rotate my shoulders back the left knee move accentuates an OTT move. It’s very interesting how the left knee move works in conjunction with proper shoulder rotation. They are connected which stupid me didn’t know until today on the course.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[tinman143]

Ah i see your point. My guess is without a full shoulder turn perhaps there’s not enough time for your arms to fall into the slot? What do I know anyway...I’m just a hack lol. Are you in SoCal? If yes stay cool! It was 104 in NorCal which is a rare thing.

 

[GolfLivesMatter]

Ah i see your point. My guess is without a full shoulder turn perhaps there’s not enough time for your arms to fall into the slot? What do I know anyway...I’m just a hack lol. Are you in SoCal? If yes stay cool! It was 104 in NorCal which is a rare thing.

I'm in Palm Springs right now. 115. Played today no problem. WATER! As for the knee / shoulder thing, it's not so much about "time" to get the arms down, but more that when the left knee pivots left it pulls the hips around....so if I have a "fake turn" meaning my shoulders don't rotate and I more lift the club the knee movement sends the club OTT...like CRAZY!! I was shanking wedges and was like WTF??? Then I stopped and went thru the basics and had an AH-HA moment. Try it for yourself.

 

[razaar]

I video all of my range sessions dtl. I've tried a couple of things on the range over the past few weeks to fix this but can't. Every single swing I can see myself gradually pushing toward the ball on the back swing and then fully diving into the ball on the downswing. Result, mostly heel hits with a slight fade.

I've tried holding the club out in front of me with my left hand and swinging under it with my right. I've tried the golf bag on the butt. I've tried swinging with my right foot back and heel on the ground through. I just can't seem to find that "feeling" I need.

Not sure if this a protection thing my body does for my lower back pain. So, looking for something different that might make my body do this.

This is some swing advice from Irvin Schloss that might help with your issue.
During the backswing we turn behind the ball with the left shoulder lowering and the right shoulder rising - the opposite of our address position. At impact the left shoulder needs to be high and the right shoulder low to facilitate staying down through the shot.
During transition from backswing to downswing the back needs to be held facing the target as both hips externally rotate with the tailbone moving away from the target. When the hands drop to their 9 o'clock position the shoulders will have tilted upwards and turned 45* towards the target. According to Irvin most handicap golfers have their shoulders turned 90* back to target at the 9 o'clock position. Those players who don't manage a 90* shoulder turn at the top of the backswing are even worse off.
Irvin's advice to those players who spin the shoulders (which he named beginner's blight) is to tilt the left shoulder upwards to change direction from backswing to downswing while externally rotating the right hip (right leg rotates away from the target). The feeling is the left shoulder rolls up and back, rotating the trunk towards the target and keeping the swing to centre. The left hip externally rotates although the player doesn't feel it. The left side stretches and the right side contracts, which is as it should be in order to stay down through impact.
Bye bye early extension.

 

[GolfLivesMatter]

This is some swing advice from Irvin Schloss that might help with your issue.
During the backswing we turn behind the ball with the left shoulder lowering and the right shoulder rising - the opposite of our address position. At impact the left shoulder needs to be high and the right shoulder low to facilitate staying down through the shot.
During transition from backswing to downswing the back needs to be held facing the target as both hips externally rotate with the tailbone moving away from the target. When the hands drop to their 9 o'clock position the shoulders will have tilted upwards and turned 45* towards the target. According to Irvin most handicap golfers have their shoulders turned 90* back to target at the 9 o'clock position. Those players who don't manage a 90* shoulder turn at the top of the backswing are even worse off.
Irvin's advice to those players who spin the shoulders (which he named beginner's blight) is to tilt the left shoulder upwards to change direction from backswing to downswing while externally rotating the right hip (right leg rotates away from the target). The feeling is the left shoulder rolls up and back, rotating the trunk towards the target and keeping the swing to centre. The left hip externally rotates although the player doesn't feel it. The left side stretches and the right side contracts, which is as it should be in order to stay down through impact.
Bye bye early extension.

Honestly, I can't possibly think of all that during a swing, even if I break it down to 1/10th second increments. However, that does describe the movement. IMO the movement is very natural IF certain parameters are met as I posted above, at least for me.

 

[tinman143]

As one can see, there are multiple solutions to address EE. You have to pick the one that that works for you but it’s very difficult to implement without video’ing yourself. Good luck

 

[GolfLivesMatter]

As one can see, there are multiple solutions to address EE. You have to pick the one that that works for you but it’s very difficult to implement without video’ing yourself. Good luck

Hey Tinman, so yesterday I went 13/14 with drives that averaged about 20-25 more yards than normal...of course while working on EE. Then today I go out and proceed to forget EVERYTHING I learned from the day before.

 

[tinman143]

Hey Tinman, so yesterday I went 13/14 with drives that averaged about 20-25 more yards than normal...of course while working on EE. Then today I go out and proceed to forget EVERYTHING I learned from the day before.

Ha remember nobody pays us to play this game. Just a reminder that we’re amateurs and it takes time to ingrain things. Even El Tigre admitted to taking about a year to get the feeling of less separation between upper and lower body.

13/14 is ridiculous btw! Keep at it

 

[WILDTHING]

Here's one of the best videos I've seen from AMG and it could cure your early extension if you can get the pelvis turn correct.

 

[razaar]

One of the main reasons for early hip extension is keeping the weight on the inside of the right foot during the upswing phase of the backswing. In anatomical language this is referred to as pronation. This triggers internal rotation of the hip which causes a hip slide towards the target and a hip stall. The body subconsciously realises it has used up the power of the right hip and leg early in the downswing so it drives the hip into extension and into a posterior pelvic tilt (the belt button pointing upwards).
For some reason popular golf instruction has the weight remaining on the inside of the right foot during the backswing. The old teachers (Bobby Jones, Abe Mitchell & others) have the weight shifting to the outside of the right foot with the lower leg retaining its address position during the upswing. With the popular golf instruction method the right hip restricts the turn of the trunk and the shoulders for most golfers. It also triggers internal rotation of the right hip which stalls rotation and leaves the right side above the hips extended. If you suffer from back issues related to golf, then this is the likely cause of those issues.

 

[McLovin]

my head hurts

 

[TrueMotionMatt]

One of the main reasons for early hip extension is keeping the weight on the inside of the right foot during the upswing phase of the backswing. In anatomical language this is referred to as pronation. This triggers internal rotation of the hip which causes a hip slide towards the target and a hip stall. The body subconsciously realises it has used up the power of the right hip and leg early in the downswing so it drives the hip into extension and into a posterior pelvic tilt (the belt button pointing upwards).
For some reason popular golf instruction has the weight remaining on the inside of the right foot during the backswing. The old teachers (Bobby Jones, Abe Mitchell & others) have the weight shifting to the outside of the right foot with the lower leg retaining its address position during the upswing. With the popular golf instruction method the right hip restricts the turn of the trunk and the shoulders for most golfers. It also triggers internal rotation of the right hip which stalls rotation and leaves the right side above the hips extended. If you suffer from back issues related to golf, then this is the likely cause of those issues.

I disagree, it's not being able to get into the ground properly and moving all over the place. I can not EE by having my weight either inside, or outside, that's not the issue. And unless you get your weight to the inside of your trail foot, you can't rotate enough.

 

[tinman143]

Here’s a follow up vid of my range session yesterday. I would say it was successful addressing my EE.

 

[TrueMotionMatt]

Here’s a follow up vid of my range session yesterday. I would say it was successful addressing my EE.

Stand taller at setup and get your armpits over the laces by rounding your upper spine. THEN get into the ground. You’re too into the ground to begin with. Watch out he Barry Bonds Video

 

[tinman143]

Thanks Matt. I just noticed youre in the bay area as well. Which part?

As a life long dodgers fan, I cannot relate to the Bonds video you shared lol!

 

[TrueMotionMatt]

Thanks Matt. I just noticed youre in the bay area as well. Which part?

As a life long dodgers fan, I cannot relate to the Bonds video you shared lol!

SF...hahaha, it's all good. But if you want to be the best, you gotta learn from the best.

 

[TrueMotionMatt]

Let's agree to disagree. I'll stick with the pressure on the outside of the foot group which includes all the legends of golf.

It's not really debatable...it's just how the body moves. When your pelvis rotates in the backswing, in order to stay centered, the pressure in your foot has to be on the inside of your right heel for a rightie...your right leg needs to extend. It's just how it is. Not sure where you heard otherwise, but that person is misinformed

 

[razaar]

My sources include publications 'Bobby Jones on Golf', 'Essentials of Golf' by Abe Mitchell. Kelvin Miyahira's Articles 'What is a hip turn, Part 1 and Part 2, and 'How to turn your hips, Part 3 the Backswing'.

 

[TrueMotionMatt]

My sources include publications 'Bobby Jones on Golf', 'Essentials of Golf' by Abe Mitchell. Kelvin Miyahira's Articles 'What is a hip turn, Part 1 and Part 2, and 'How to turn your hips, Part 3 the Backswing'.

Is this Steve Elkington? Abe Mitchell's book has a lot of things that aren't "correct"... and pretty goofy. Also, they were playing Hickories most of their lives. I wouldn't use those as examples over the pics I just showed you of some of the finest players ever.

 

[razaar]

No not Elk, I have a very extensive golf library. I was fortunate to play and practice with Cam Smith a few times a week (when he was home) from when he was a budding amateur to playing on the USPGA tour.

 

[GolfLivesMatter]

I posted on another thread about using an impact bag which is how I'm training-out EE and getting into a proper and powerful impact position. In all honesty my brain cannot process all the details as to how body parts are moving...I'd be a human pretzel. However, when using the impact bag I get immediate feedback on impact position "look" (like in a mirror) plus the volume of the thud at impact. I am now generating much louder thuds even with 1/2 swings vs. my prior EE-like full swing impact position. For me, I started with proper impact position based upon the observations of two pro instructors. Then I worked backwards as to how to get into that position. I think it took about 5 swings for my body to start figuring out that the lower body must engage first to not only get into a far better impact position, but also to generate a far louder impact thud sound. It's like night and day.

 

[GolfLivesMatter]

Just to throw in one more thought....what I discovered is EE is caused by swinging with the arms and shoulders from the top, or going from 0-100 far too early with the wrong body parts. When that happens my left leg thinks the swing is "done" about halfway down and thus the left leg extends and that blocks the hips from rotation. I call it my "backwards swing". This may sound simplistic to some, but I have replicated the early-ultra speed swing and each time my left leg pumps up early, and actually sends my left hip forward for the block.

 

[CB67]

This Malaska Video cured my early extension and shows how straight line forces make your hip sockets go back.

One swing thought : as club head comes into the ball, use left leg to push left hip socket back. Start with little pitch shots and work your way up. This was a life changing Video for me as it showed me finally what pivot truly is.