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Mizuno fitting questions

Nippon Shafts
fern

fern

constant club ponderer
Joined
Jun 10, 2011
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Location
France
Handicap
11.3
Just wondering if anyone could give me a little advice following a mizuno fitting the other day. This might get to be a bit of a long post, but I'll try to keep it readable!

So on Sunday Morning I spent about 45 minutes with a mizuno rep who was at my local course here in France. This was arranged for me by the guy in the pro shop, but with no pressure to buy at all. He simply knows that I am, in true Hackers paradise style, always tempted by new equipment:act-up:

The mizuno rep isn't a salesman, he is a demo/fitting guy.

A bit of background-I'm a bogey golfer, but have always been able to hit the ball quite well, but with inconsistancies, particularly direction. I don't know really how I sit on the scale of fast/slow swingers, but I am 6 ft 6 tall and tend to go after the ball a bit.

I play with all sorts of stuff from blades (wilson fg 62) to pings (a mix of isi, g5 and other odds and ends). I score equally badly regardless!

I had time to warm up before the fitting quite well and was hitting it ok, but with a fait few fattish shots, a current problem as I work on my swing.

The mizuno guy put my straight into a shaft an inch over and, I believe, 2° upright. I think the first one I tried was a dynalite stiff and I hit a few different heads with S300 shafts. The first thing that was really obvious to me was that an extra inch made a huge difference. I thought it would make my fat shots worse, but now I'm wondering if the fat shots were more a product of me bending my knees too much to make shorter shafts work.

Perhaps this extra inch was a confidence thing, but I started hitting the ball really well. The only other longer shaft/upright lie I have played was my di11s a couple of years ago when I was starting out (again). Now I think about it, I can't remember hitting very much fat or thin with them-I just had problems with the ball going sky high and direction being a bit of a problem, particularly high and left.

So things are going well with the fitting, I did the shaft dna and the ball is flying high and reasonably straight. The fitter then says to try one more shaft and for me it clearly felt better than the rest. suddenly the ball was going dead straight, a little lower and felt really solid. I got a quote from the pro shop guy and told him that maybe next year if I can sell a few clubs I would be in position to order.

Now here comes the questions (and thanks for reading this far). The last shaft was a px 6.5. This didn't really mean a lot to me. I know it is a stiff shaft, but apart from that... So when I got home a did a bit of write up for a French golf forum on my fitting talking about how much I had enjoyed the process and which head/shaft combo felt best. I then got absolutely roasted by everyone who replied for saying that I liked the px 6.5. I was told in no uncertain terms that an 18 handicapper shouldn't be looking at that sort of shaft.

I now feel a bit confused. I'm old enough not to worry about having the stiffest shaft possible to impress. I told the fitter I would be happy if the final combination was the EZ irons on senior flex graphite and really, that wouldn't be a problem if it works for me (hell, maybe it does, I haven't tried).

Is it possible that a px 6.5 could be a good choice? does an inch overlength make a difference to the flex, maybe making it a more realistic proposition? The fitter said that it was more to do with how I swing (very vertical I think he said) than just the swing speed (which was, again I think, something like 88 or 89 mph with a 6 iron. I wish I had noted the DNA numbers (I think two of them were 7, but I can't remember which order they were in)

I'm now thinking that I'll wait till he comes back (hopefully at the start of the summer) and maybe try some different combinations. Maybe the extra inch meant I was just hitting it more solidly than usual? Any ideas?
 
The only thing I can say is that every swing is different and require different shafts. Handicap is by no means a measure for how stiff shafts you can use. I've got friends who need x-stiff, and they swing 115+ MPH, and drive long as pro's, but they can't aim, they can't chip, they can't putt. They play at 20+ HCP.

The last time I was fitted, I hit a X-stiff driver shaft longer and straighter than the stiff shafts I tried...with the same swing speed, about a 100MPH. I didn't take the X-stiff since it didn't feel comfortable.
 
I had a fitting done not too long ago and one thing stuck with me from the fitter. "The numbers don't lie" That optimizer is going to tell you straight up what it collects, then it'll tell you what should work best for your swing. It gave you three or so options strictly for feel (everyone is different). Long story short, if that shaft felt good and the numbers on the optimizer support that option - don't worry about anything else. Some yahoos opinion that those shaft are terrible for you doesn't mean jack. And for reference my 6 iron SS was 89 and I loved the X100 soft stepped once. We've got the same speed, but totally different conclusion

swing your swing

And good luck with the new sticks
 
Handicap should never dictate what shaft or head type to use. The Px shafts are really nice and the slight bit more stiffness over the S300 will more often than not lead to better shot dispersion and lower ball flight, no doubt about it. The only thing I will say is that if you're having a day when you're not swinging well I'd imagine you'd start leaking shots a little right. I'm a par golfer and use the KBS Tour in S flex which have an FCM of 6.5 so they're the same as the Px6.5's in reality. They feel totally different but I find them super controllable. In closing I would say trust the fitter, he's trained (I'm assuming by Mizuno?) to do that job and it's not in his best interest to steer you in the wrong direction.
 
Thanks for the replies. I suppose I'm really second-guessing the fitter because of the reactions I had. IT felt really nice, but as soon as I started hearing that I shouldn't be playing that sort of shaft, I started having a few doubts:bulgy-eyes:

I know a lot of people love Mizuno stuff, but to be honest I never really considered Mizuno rather than any other manufacturer. Having hit the clubs, I really did enjoy it, but that might have been the case if as well if it were a Titleist/wilson/cleveland or whatever fitting.

It is just that a new set of shiny mizunos looks like I'll have to sell one of my children to pay for it and I really want to get rid of any doubts before doing that!

I've just been looking on the Mizuno site and doing a fitting at their centre in Paris doesn't seem to be too expensive so maybe it would be worth hopping on the train sometime early next year and trying.

The other thing I am thinking about it trying to find a club that is in those specs (maybe an ex demo) and taking it out on the course for a few weeks to see how it feels.
 
Those are all good ideas and it's a good thing you're putting a lot of thought into choosing a new set of irons. You need to realise though that on golf forums there are always people who think they know more than they actually do. For that reason it's best to trust fitters, even if you make an effort of getting fit by a few different ones to make sure there's some consistency to what they're recommending. If you went to one fitter and he suggested PX6.5 shafts and the next suggested an R flex etc etc etc then you'd have reason for doubt but that's highly unlikely. Good luck!!!!!
 
Are you sure it wasn't a 5.5? I was fit into S300s and PX 5.5 and went with the S300s for a lower flight.
 
If you can demo a club with all of your specs definitely go for it. Leave no doubt in your mind when you make the investment. Your specs may be hard to come by demo wise.
Not sure of the industry over there, but some club fitters you can sweet talk into them letting you borrow the fitting club set to what you need for a day or two. Take it to the range and really get a feel for your shot shape, etc.
 
Sounds like he knew what he was doing and you had what I call an "aha" moment. Every now and then you find something as a fitter that just clicks with someone's swing. With your swing attributes, I do not think a 6.5 would be out of the realm of possibility (and yes, it plays slightly softer because of the extra length).

fern said:
Just wondering if anyone could give me a little advice following a mizuno fitting the other day. This might get to be a bit of a long post, but I'll try to keep it readable!

So on Sunday Morning I spent about 45 minutes with a mizuno rep who was at my local course here in France. This was arranged for me by the guy in the pro shop, but with no pressure to buy at all. He simply knows that I am, in true Hackers paradise style, always tempted by new equipment:act-up:

The mizuno rep isn't a salesman, he is a demo/fitting guy.

A bit of background-I'm a bogey golfer, but have always been able to hit the ball quite well, but with inconsistancies, particularly direction. I don't know really how I sit on the scale of fast/slow swingers, but I am 6 ft 6 tall and tend to go after the ball a bit.

I play with all sorts of stuff from blades (wilson fg 62) to pings (a mix of isi, g5 and other odds and ends). I score equally badly regardless!

I had time to warm up before the fitting quite well and was hitting it ok, but with a fait few fattish shots, a current problem as I work on my swing.

The mizuno guy put my straight into a shaft an inch over and, I believe, 2° upright. I think the first one I tried was a dynalite stiff and I hit a few different heads with S300 shafts. The first thing that was really obvious to me was that an extra inch made a huge difference. I thought it would make my fat shots worse, but now I'm wondering if the fat shots were more a product of me bending my knees too much to make shorter shafts work.

Perhaps this extra inch was a confidence thing, but I started hitting the ball really well. The only other longer shaft/upright lie I have played was my di11s a couple of years ago when I was starting out (again). Now I think about it, I can't remember hitting very much fat or thin with them-I just had problems with the ball going sky high and direction being a bit of a problem, particularly high and left.

So things are going well with the fitting, I did the shaft dna and the ball is flying high and reasonably straight. The fitter then says to try one more shaft and for me it clearly felt better than the rest. suddenly the ball was going dead straight, a little lower and felt really solid. I got a quote from the pro shop guy and told him that maybe next year if I can sell a few clubs I would be in position to order.

Now here comes the questions (and thanks for reading this far). The last shaft was a px 6.5. This didn't really mean a lot to me. I know it is a stiff shaft, but apart from that... So when I got home a did a bit of write up for a French golf forum on my fitting talking about how much I had enjoyed the process and which head/shaft combo felt best. I then got absolutely roasted by everyone who replied for saying that I liked the px 6.5. I was told in no uncertain terms that an 18 handicapper shouldn't be looking at that sort of shaft.

I now feel a bit confused. I'm old enough not to worry about having the stiffest shaft possible to impress. I told the fitter I would be happy if the final combination was the EZ irons on senior flex graphite and really, that wouldn't be a problem if it works for me (hell, maybe it does, I haven't tried).

Is it possible that a px 6.5 could be a good choice? does an inch overlength make a difference to the flex, maybe making it a more realistic proposition? The fitter said that it was more to do with how I swing (very vertical I think he said) than just the swing speed (which was, again I think, something like 88 or 89 mph with a 6 iron. I wish I had noted the DNA numbers (I think two of them were 7, but I can't remember which order they were in)

I'm now thinking that I'll wait till he comes back (hopefully at the start of the summer) and maybe try some different combinations. Maybe the extra inch meant I was just hitting it more solidly than usual? Any ideas?
Click to expand...
 
I think playing a shaft that fits your swing would dictate what your handicap will result more than how much your handicap dictating what shaft you play :)

Sent from my SM-N900T using Tapatalk
 
Sir Swingsalot said:
I had a fitting done not too long ago and one thing stuck with me from the fitter. "The numbers don't lie" That optimizer is going to tell you straight up what it collects, then it'll tell you what should work best for your swing. It gave you three or so options strictly for feel (everyone is different). Long story short, if that shaft felt good and the numbers on the optimizer support that option - don't worry about anything else. Some yahoos opinion that those shaft are terrible for you doesn't mean jack. And for reference my 6 iron SS was 89 and I loved the X100 soft stepped once. We've got the same speed, but totally different conclusion

swing your swing

And good luck with the new sticks
Click to expand...


What Swingsalot said. If the numbers are good and YOU feel good hitting them then they are the right setup. Go for it!
 
SaffaClint said:
Those are all good ideas and it's a good thing you're putting a lot of thought into choosing a new set of irons. You need to realise though that on golf forums there are always people who think they know more than they actually do. For that reason it's best to trust fitters, even if you make an effort of getting fit by a few different ones to make sure there's some consistency to what they're recommending. If you went to one fitter and he suggested PX6.5 shafts and the next suggested an R flex etc etc etc then you'd have reason for doubt but that's highly unlikely. Good luck!!!!!
Click to expand...

Thanks Saffaclint. I think I'll need to get fit at least once more by someone and if they result is pretty similar I know I'll be good to go.

mrvandelay said:
Are you sure it wasn't a 5.5? I was fit into S300s and PX 5.5 and went with the S300s for a lower flight.
Click to expand...

No, definitely a 6.5 I spent a fait bit of time looking at the demo club and thinking if there was anyway to sneak it into my bag at the end of the session:act-up:

Sir Swingsalot said:
If you can demo a club with all of your specs definitely go for it. Leave no doubt in your mind when you make the investment. Your specs may be hard to come by demo wise.
Not sure of the industry over there, but some club fitters you can sweet talk into them letting you borrow the fitting club set to what you need for a day or two. Take it to the range and really get a feel for your shot shape, etc.
Click to expand...

Fitting is a bit more difficult over here and it does look like finding a club in (or near to) my specs might be a bit tough. Like you say, I really want to take any doubt out of the purchase because it will be no fun the first time I thin/fat/slice/whatever an iron shot thinking that it might not be the best set up after all.

bellairemi said:
Sounds like he knew what he was doing and you had what I call an "aha" moment. Every now and then you find something as a fitter that just clicks with someone's swing. With your swing attributes, I do not think a 6.5 would be out of the realm of possibility (and yes, it plays slightly softer because of the extra length).
Click to expand...

Yes, that's really what it felt like. Now I've looked at the shaft/head combo a bit more and read what people have said, it just seems like an odd one to have worked for an average golfer like me. No doubt though, thinking back it really did feel very nice!

kc720 said:
I think playing a shaft that fits your swing would dictate what your handicap will result more than how much your handicap dictating what shaft you play :)

Sent from my SM-N900T using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

That is what I'm thinking. Obviously I have a lot to work in in my game and I certainly enjoy doing that, but I'm wondering now just how much playing with tuff which is miles off fitting might have been costing. I'm sure that even just getting anything longer and more upright with a stiff shaft would be a great starting point.




flaMtneer said:
What Swingsalot said. If the numbers are good and YOU feel good hitting them then they are the right setup. Go for it!
Click to expand...

That's what it comes down to, isn't it?

Thanks again for the replies, some great advice as always from THP. I think my first step is, as I said above, to get hold of something that is longer, stiffer and more upright. I really did like those mizzie sticks though and it is my fortieth birthday next year.....but I think I'm not doing myself any favours by trying to fit in with standard when, at 6ft 6, I would probably do better with at least the right length and lie. I think I'll have a look on ebay or maybe components and get something to practise with while I save up for the mizunos.
 
88-89 ss with a 6-iron is faster than average. That, along with what your fitter said about every swing being different, and finding the shaft for your swing is what matters.

I currently play the MP-53's (Thank you Mizuno and THP!) I used the Mizuno Shaft Optimizer during my fitting. It recommended KBS Tour X shafts. I've never played an X shaft in an iron. But, the fitter did not disagree with the MSO results, especially based on the visual evidence, which is what he prefers over "just numbers'. And, he is someone I play golf with 5-10x a year, and is also a friend. So, I value his judgement.

During the fitting, were you hitting outdoors, capturing the full visual effect of the shot? Or, were you hitting into a net or on a simulator?
 
I never go by what other people think about what I put in my bag. As long as I like it and it work, that's all that matters. If you spent time with the shaft and you liked it, go with it. While some take the Shaft Optimizer as gospel, I usually take what it suggests as a starting point and work from there. It has always put me in a x-stiff or a soft-stepped x-stiff. I did a soft stepped x-stiff and my hands were killing me after a round or practice, so I went down to a stiff and have been fine since.

But like I said above, don't let the opinion of people on a message board completely influence your decision. Most of them have probably not played with you and know nothing about your game. If you watched me play tee to green you would think I'm a single digit. But then I have putt and/or chip and all hell breaks loose. I'm a 12 who has 37-42 putts per round.....
 
staticline said:
88-89 ss with a 6-iron is faster than average. That, along with what your fitter said about every swing being different, and finding the shaft for your swing is what matters.

I currently play the MP-53's (Thank you Mizuno and THP!) I used the Mizuno Shaft Optimizer during my fitting. It recommended KBS Tour X shafts. I've never played an X shaft in an iron. But, the fitter did not disagree with the MSO results, especially based on the visual evidence, which is what he prefers over "just numbers'. And, he is someone I play golf with 5-10x a year, and is also a friend. So, I value his judgement.

During the fitting, were you hitting outdoors, capturing the full visual effect of the shot? Or, were you hitting into a net or on a simulator?
Click to expand...

I was hitting outside on the range, but off mats. I probably need to hit off grass, especially for the choice of clubhead, but in terms of ball flight I definitely found it good to be see the ball flight. i don't know enough about the numbers to really interpret simulator stuff. What was obvious, even to me, was that the ball seemed to get up and then sort of 'stay' if that makes sense? The fitter said after the first couple something along the lines of "that's it, it just pushes out there". I never know what people mean by piercing ball flight, but I'm guessing that was it.

As I said before, I use a few different sets of irons and I often have the feeling of hitting the ball quite nicely and it seems to go quite high, but then being surprised that it hasn't actually gone as far as I thought. I get a few comments on this from playing partners too.

I always put this down to maybe being a bit of a shorter hitter than I really appear from watching me swing, but now I am wondering if the shaft has been partly responsible too.

The shaft I hit most often is an fst pro 115. Stiff. I don.t know a lot about it, but I always seem to hit it high but it is never really as far as I thought it was going to be. I'm certainly finding it interesting just what a big difference different shafts can make.



adamw238 said:
I never go by what other people think about what I put in my bag. As long as I like it and it work, that's all that matters. If you spent time with the shaft and you liked it, go with it. While some take the Shaft Optimizer as gospel, I usually take what it suggests as a starting point and work from there. It has always put me in a x-stiff or a soft-stepped x-stiff. I did a soft stepped x-stiff and my hands were killing me after a round or practice, so I went down to a stiff and have been fine since.

But like I said above, don't let the opinion of people on a message board completely influence your decision. Most of them have probably not played with you and know nothing about your game. If you watched me play tee to green you would think I'm a single digit. But then I have putt and/or chip and all hell breaks loose. I'm a 12 who has 37-42 putts per round.....
Click to expand...
Sounds like you putt even worse than me, I didn't think that was possible!:act-up: Goes to show though that handicap on its own doesn't give the whole picture. I often play with a gut who is about a 9 handicap. He is by no means the best ball striker I know, he doesn't hit it very long at all, but I virtually never see him fail to get up and down from round the green.
 
YIKES, 37-42 putts per round! You poor poor man, do you want a hug :hug-right::laugh:
 
SaffaClint said:
YIKES, 37-42 putts per round! You poor poor man, do you want a hug :hug-right::laugh:
Click to expand...
I think most of the time I need an old priest and a young priest. :sad:
 
Handicap has nothing to do with club shaft selection. My 74 year old father in law plays scratch to +3 golf.

His back swing is only waist high. He looks like he is throwing a sack of feed in a truck when he swings.

His driver barely goes 200 yards. His swing speed is 23.5 mph. His drive only gets about 30 foot off of the ground.

I hit my Mizuno 5 iron (x 100 shaft) 205 yards in the summer. He hits my 5 iron 75 yards about 12 foot off of the ground.

I usually score 92 to 94 for 18 holes. I play 9 to 18 holes a week.

My father in law plays 96 to114 holes a week+ everyday practice in the yard. (We have 16 acres and he mows a
practice range in the middle of it.)


Handicap or score has nothing to do with club/shaft selection.

I see these adds showing a driver with a 3 degree loft and xxxxxxxxxxstiff shaft (Only for low handicap players)

They should try it with my father in law. He would prove them different.

Jackal

I just plain suck at putting, and course management.
 
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