Slicefixer

[UglySwing]

I recently heard about this book.

I looked it up on YT, and came across a video of his (Geoff Jones) swing. It is an absolute thing of beauty.
I can't normally even discern one nice swing from another, but his swing just looks so nice and smooth...


I'd like to learn to release this way. I downloaded the book, and have started reading through it. I'm still very 'handsy' in my release.

Anyways, the book starts out with a short story about himself, and something he was taught in college that ultimately totally screwed up his swing:
"...you've GOT to swing inside-to-out and release those wrists...turn the toe to the ground at impact.”

This was what I was taught by my first (only) instructor.

It never made sense to me. I was only 6-8 months into golf. While it killed my swing, it wasn't that big a deal b/c I sucked anyways.

Does anyone know what the logic behind that swing approach is?

Anyways, there is an old (and long) thread on the subject.

Is anyone still doing this?
Anyone have any other input on it?

 

[JB]

Mward uses it. Flies out to bumfuq to go see the guy. Wardy used to be really good too.
He would say it made him better, I would argue it made him technical and took the feel out of his game. In the end, his opinion is all that matters.

 

[fupresti]

Mward uses it. Flies out to bumfuq to go see the guy. Wardy used to be really good too.
He would say it made him better, I would argue it made him technical and took the feel out of his game. In the end, his opinion is all that matters.

And it requires him to play his irons at 6* flat, turning him into a crybaby anytime an OEM looks at him like a weirdo for playing irons 6* flat.

 

[mancest]

Is the book actually out? It has been rumored for years (I have been hearing about it since 2012). I have the Encyclopedia Texarkana printed out somewhere. Interesting stuff, but I have had some success with an instructor locally and haven't looked at it for a while.

There are a few threads if you use the search function.

http://www.thehackersparadise.com/forum/showthread.php?26233-Any-Slicefixer-Fans

 

[MWard]

Guys... How about we pump the brakes on how I swing, deal?

 

[UglySwing]

Guys... How about we pump the brakes on how I swing, deal?

Well, if it means anything to you, if you swing anything at all like him...I could just sit and watch you swing for hours (and not in a Pamela Anderson kind of way either).

 

[JB]

Guys... How about we pump the brakes on how I swing, deal?

FWIW Ward, I didnt think I said anything negative about your swing. I just said I thought it made you technical, and that you really like it and that is all that matters. But its cool, I was trying to help a guy who was asking about feedback.

 

[UglySwing]

I went to the range and hit balls (with a TourStriker iron) utilizing this method doing only the 9 to 3 drill.

Its hard to learn just via his online booklet and some videos, but I worked on the grip for the last couple days.

Im a 'flipper'. I didn't really realize that until this am. Watched a great video by Crossfield that finally made clear to me what a flipper was.
Apparently, it's me.

Holding the proper release (without flipping) is really awkward. My instincts ('habits' is probably a better term) tell me to flip at impact. It took me 10-15 balls to stop doing that.

Doing only the 9-3 drill I was able to generate a lot more power than I would have imagined, and my balls were more accurate than normal.

However, while it felt more natural by the end, it was a very foreign swing, and I was really tense through the arms and hands trying to hold my grip, and trying to stop myself from flipping my wrists.

It seems to show promise. However, never, ever get fired up by a single range session (or even a week or two of them). This game will slap you upside the head with some humble pie really quickly.

 

[UglySwing]

Here's a link to Crossfield's 'release' video that does a fantastic job of showing how/why flipping occurs, and how to stop it.

 

[1965]

Turn your right hand over = slice fixed.

Now you can straighten out that new hook! :banana:

 

[UglySwing]

Turn your right hand over = slice fixed.

Now you can straighten out that new hook! :banana:

Thankfully, I don't have a slice problem (only the 'hook' you speak of). That's just the nickname of Geoff Jones I believe.

But, check back in a couple months, and I may in fact have a slice going.

 

[MWard]

FWIW Ward, I didnt think I said anything negative about your swing. I just said I thought it made you technical, and that you really like it and that is all that matters. But its cool, I was trying to help a guy who was asking about feedback.

I've always been a technical player, any feel I had or don't have anymore is due to a lack of practice. I have no time to practice anymore, or a good location to do it. Hard to have good touch when it's all rusty.

Then again, our weather isn't letting that happen as easily either.

 

[Alez367]

Guys... How about we pump the brakes on how I swing, deal?

Ward, this is not a knock on your swing but has the specs of your irons helped you to eliminate one side of the course? I want to eliminate the double sided miss and thinking of tinkering with lie adjustment.


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[MWard]

Ward, this is not a knock on your swing but has the specs of your irons helped you to eliminate one side of the course? I want to eliminate the double sided miss and thinking of tinkering with lie adjustment.


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I can still hit a snap hook when I spin out. Usually it's a drop kick, and usually I know it's gonna happen right when I transition. It gets quick, and it's just the worst feeling in the world knowing it's going low and left before I ever hit the ball.

When I'm in sync and not swinging like an ass, I usually hit it pretty well I guess.

 

[Plin]

The feel or traditional release is very much timing based and works great with a variety of very athletic players or with great amount of practice, the bio mechanical or body release is more of a new approach to the swing that I believe would help more people to achieve great impact more consistently. Paying attention to tour players, and there's an obvious shift in methodology, just paying attention to the finish off the swings, there have been more hold off finishes than ever before (see Danny Lee)

I believe the body release is key to having a swing for life and still have plenty of power even as our bodies get older.

 

[McLovin]

The feel or traditional release is very much timing based and works great with a variety of very athletic players or with great amount of practice, the bio mechanical or body release is more of a new approach to the swing that I believe would help more people to achieve great impact more consistently. Paying attention to tour players, and there's an obvious shift in methodology, just paying attention to the finish off the swings, there have been more hold off finishes than ever before (see Danny Lee)

I believe the body release is key to having a swing for life and still have plenty of power even as our bodies get older.

they're both based on timing. how is one any less dependent on timing than another?


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[Mystery Meat]

The feel or traditional release is very much timing based and works great with a variety of very athletic players or with great amount of practice, the bio mechanical or body release is more of a new approach to the swing that I believe would help more people to achieve great impact more consistently. Paying attention to tour players, and there's an obvious shift in methodology, just paying attention to the finish off the swings, there have been more hold off finishes than ever before (see Danny Lee)

I believe the body release is key to having a swing for life and still have plenty of power even as our bodies get older.

What a great great post. I'm not sure who slice fixer, but your post is identical to what I'm working on now. More about arms being connected to the body releasing .. Versus a hand flip release which I had for decades and would struggle with at times. Feel like the club never turns over but the body turning squares it up with being connected

a very very nice post my friend. You nailed it . Wish I could give you a thousand thank you hits for it

 

[Plin]

they're both based on timing. how is one any less dependent on timing than another?


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The amount of timing allowed is directly related to how much time the club takes from open to close.

When a lot of hand and wrist action is used, the amount of time the club stays square is much shorter than when you allow your big muscles do the rotation and the arms and hands do their rotation naturally.

This way the club stays square much longer leading to more square impact more consistently.

There's no right or wrong method, just more difficult or easier to maintain. By eliminating hand action, you're reducing one more variable to account for while allowing more time for the club to deliver to the ball squarely.

Keep in mind this is also correlated to how steep or shallow your swing plane is coming into the impact zone, the more vertical or steep, the less time it stays in the impact zone, think a V as opposed to a U shape, the club stays around the bottom of the arc for longer, allowing more time to impact the ball and eliminate using precise timing to find the center of the club.

 

[McLovin]

The amount of timing allowed is directly related to how much time the club takes from open to close.

When a lot of hand and wrist action is used, the amount of time the club stays square is much shorter than when you allow your big muscles do the rotation and the arms and hands do their rotation naturally.

This way the club stays square much longer leading to more square impact more consistently.

There's no right or wrong method, just more difficult or easier to maintain. By eliminating hand action, you're reducing one more variable to account for while allowing more time for the club to deliver to the ball squarely.

Keep in mind this is also correlated to how steep or shallow your swing plane is coming into the impact zone, the more vertical or steep, the less time it stays in the impact zone, think a V as opposed to a U shape, the club stays around the bottom of the arc for longer, allowing more time to impact the ball and eliminate using precise timing to find the center of the club.

opening or closing suggests fanning the face relative to the plane. I think wrist hinge and unhinge is entirely possible while maintaining the face square to the plane. and if you remove the wrist hinge, you've put a lot of pressure on the core muscles to generate power and removed the power accumulator of the wrists and forearms. I don't mean to discount a more rotary swing, but I think it's tough for most of us to do. I eventually moved away from s&t because of this; it was just too much emphasis on core and it beat my hip to hell.


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[Mystery Meat]

Scanned thru the document from the slice fixer. Interesting read , but sounds like it might be a little tough to do from just that. Does this teacher have an online golf program you can join ? Or maybe see if you can go to him in person . Also looks like he has a huge following on golf wrx. That might be a great place to learn more and maybe find others that can help you along. It's easy to get lost in deciphering text, and this looks very very involved

 

[mancest]

He put out a couple videos if I recall, but I think Wardy has gone to visit him in Texarkana. There are other threads that go into a lot of detail, but I also have read his "manifesto" but think it would be really difficult to get the right moves ingrained just off of that.

I think he can be contacted on Facebook to set up instruction, but I think it is quite the commitment to swing like this. Just my $0.02, but hopefully those that have actually got instruction from him can enlighten us.

Scanned thru the document from the slice fixer. Interesting read , but sounds like it might be a little tough to do from just that. Does this teacher have an online golf program you can join ? Or maybe see if you can go to him in person . Also looks like he has a huge following on golf wrx. That might be a great place to learn more and maybe find others that can help you along. It's easy to get lost in deciphering text, and this looks very very involved

 

[Mystery Meat]

He put out a couple videos if I recall, but I think Wardy has gone to visit him in Texarkana. There are other threads that go into a lot of detail, but I also have read his "manifesto" but think it would be really difficult to get the right moves ingrained just off of that.

I think he can be contacted on Facebook to set up instruction, but I think it is quite the commitment to swing like this. Just my $0.02, but hopefully those that have actually got instruction from him can enlighten us.

All these golf program methods are a commitment. There was one I was looking into that had the theme of no golf for at least 2 seasons. Just focus on the program and practicing... Than the 3 rd year involved all on course material implementing the 2 year commitment of drills. I do my best to give this stuff a fair try, but have to admit that some of these methods go way overboard. Hate to invest all energy if the returns are minimal ... But I guess you never know until you at least try

 

[mancest]

I don't dislike the commitment aspect of it, but my concern was doing something without having someone there to let me know if I am on the right track especially when it is not the most natural swing to most golfers. I am trying to unlearn tons of bad habits right now, so I would not jump into anything where you aren't getting someone to guide you.

If people want to commit to the golf swing and the practice/work element is what they enjoy, then more power to them. Personally I enjoy playing this game, and while I want to improve I would never commit to something where they kept you from playing. Again, to each their own, and I think we are getting off the topic at hand.

All these golf program methods are a commitment. There was one I was looking into that had the theme of no golf for at least 2 seasons. Just focus on the program and practicing... Than the 3 rd year involved all on course material implementing the 2 year commitment of drills. I do my best to give this stuff a fair try, but have to admit that some of these methods go way overboard. Hate to invest all energy if the returns are minimal ... But I guess you never know until you at least try

 

[UglySwing]

I believe people can go take 2-3 days of lessons with him in Texarcana. It appears as though he's very busy...Call or shoot him an e-mail and he goes over available times and cost at that point.

There is a disciple of his in Great Britain (http://www.danwhittakergolf.com) that provides on-line lessons. He has quite a few videos on YT. Who knows how his teachings compare to Slicefixers though???

After not being a big fan of taking lessons, I'm considering flying out to Texarcana. I just got an e-mail reply from Geoff this am, and will give him a call to go over things further.

 

[Plin]

opening or closing suggests fanning the face relative to the plane. I think wrist hinge and unhinge is entirely possible while maintaining the face square to the plane. and if you remove the wrist hinge, you've put a lot of pressure on the core muscles to generate power and removed the power accumulator of the wrists and forearms. I don't mean to discount a more rotary swing, but I think it's tough for most of us to do. I eventually moved away from s&t because of this; it was just too much emphasis on core and it beat my hip to hell.


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The body release doesn't mean no wrist or hand action. It means you don't use your hands to actively control the face of the club. When done properly you simply guide the face back to square rather than actively shutting it in the down swing.

It's not entirely natural feeling to do but it's certainly worth the work. Although I also believe it doesn't have to work for everyone either. Many ways to achieve the same goal is what makes this game great.