TaylorMade Forged irons: Coming next year?

[TC]

FLTC in action! As I have said before, these irons intrigue me. I am glad that the US is getting some forged offerings that are not blades. I think I will refer to them as the working man's forged irons.

darn right! that's how i roll.

At my lesson last Saturday the pro was gushing about these irons. He thinks they look amazing and will be great sticks. I'll have to hold off on judging them till I see them in person.

i'm hoping that they look better in hand as well OEM. i'm still really on the fence about the removable weight, but hey! that is TM though isn't it?

 

[SethO]

i'm hoping that they look better in hand as well OEM. i'm still really on the fence about the removable weight, but hey! that is TM though isn't it?

Anything that allows instant customization I am all for. I think that these irons have a bit of an industrial feel to them and I bet they are very beautiful in person. They are different and that is usually a good thing in my book.

 

[Kmac]

darn right! that's how i roll.



i'm hoping that they look better in hand as well OEM. i'm still really on the fence about the removable weight, but hey! that is TM though isn't it?

Sure is bro. I guess they know what theyre doing too, we shall see.

 

[TC]

Anything that allows instant customization I am all for. I think that these irons have a bit of an industrial feel to them and I bet they are very beautiful in person. They are different and that is usually a good thing in my book.

Sure is bro. I guess they know what theyre doing too, we shall see.

yeah, you can't deny that they don't know what they're doing. like i said, really interested in seening these in person and imo, if at a somewhat decent price point (maybe somewhere at or around $999, or even below) they'll hit a homerun. i think there's a huge market for forged irons out there, although callaway may dispute that based off Diablo Forged sales (i've heard from shops around here that they've been tough to move).

 

[Tmex]

I know for me, the price point of the forged is the only thing that kept me away. Awesome clubs imo. I would game those bad boys in a minute. But when you come out with a forged version of another line, and they look similar, it can be hard to differentiate the two (and the price that comes along with the forged). I really hope TM learns from that with these clubs and makes them somewhat more "feasible".

 

[SethO]

yeah, you can't deny that they don't know what they're doing. like i said, really interested in seening these in person and imo, if at a somewhat decent price point (maybe somewhere at or around $999, or even below) they'll hit a homerun. i think there's a huge market for forged irons out there, although callaway may dispute that based off Diablo Forged sales (i've heard from shops around here that they've been tough to move).

I think Calloway really screwed up on the marketing of the DF irons as well as sticking a uniflex shaft in there. If they would have put DG S300 shafts stock, I think a lot of people would have been more inclined to buy them because most 15-55 year old golfers probably have swing speeds where a S300 would fit much better than a uniflex.

 

[ddec]

I think Calloway really screwed up on the marketing of the DF irons as well as sticking a uniflex shaft in there. If they would have put DG S300 shafts stock, I think a lot of people would have been more inclined to buy them because most 15-55 year old golfers probably have swing speeds where a S300 would fit much better than a uniflex.

and those were some sweet feeling irons...I hit a few shots with yours on the range and love them

 

[TC]

I know for me, the price point of the forged is the only thing that kept me away. Awesome clubs imo. I would game those bad boys in a minute. But when you come out with a forged version of another line, and they look similar, it can be hard to differentiate the two (and the price that comes along with the forged). I really hope TM learns from that with these clubs and makes them somewhat more "feasible".

I think Calloway really screwed up on the marketing of the DF irons as well as sticking a uniflex shaft in there. If they would have put DG S300 shafts stock, I think a lot of people would have been more inclined to buy them because most 15-55 year old golfers probably have swing speeds where a S300 would fit much better than a uniflex.

i think you both make some great points. i've never understood why one companies forged offerings are so much more than others (think about mizuno, and how a lot of their forged offerings are right in line, maybe a little more expensive, than other OEM's GI offering). i understand that TM has a certain price point covered with the R9 and the 2.0 but why not have a forged offering that's 100-150 clams more, rather than 350-400 clams more?

i honestly think that some OEM can really lay claim to a huge forged market, if only they don't price themselves out of it. we'll see i guess.

 

[JB]

i honestly think that some OEM can really lay claim to a huge forged market, if only they don't price themselves out of it. we'll see i guess.

I guess you could say the same in reverse. Take Mizuno for example. Why were their cast GI offerings such as the MX-1000 close to double what most other companies were charging?

 

[Puttin4Bird]

You know I was really expecting to be a little more reluctant to fall for the 2.0s like I did coming from a forged iron (Mizuno) but for me it wasn't really that much different. Sure the forged Mizunos I was playing had a great feel to them and the feedback etc was 2nd to none, they feel amazing when struck solidly and on and on. The 2.0s feel every bit as good to me, feedback isn't there as much but....now I know you're thinking "wrong thread dude" but hang on a sec. The point I'm trying to make is that just because an iron is forged doesn't mean it'll be better. I am sure any TM offering (forged or not) will be a good stick, but people are really gushing about the forged part of it and I'm afraid you guys might be setting yourself up for a little bit of a let down when they're not a million times better than what you have now (assuming you're playing something relatively up to date).

 

[Tmex]

That's a good point P4B. When I am at the range I warm up with a club from the very first set of irons I owned. Forged blades. When struck sweet they feel great but so do a lot of the newer GI clubs.

For me, I'm really excited to see what TM can bring to the table with their technology.

 

[TC]

I guess you could say the same in reverse. Take Mizuno for example. Why were their cast GI offerings such as the MX-1000 close to double what most other companies were charging?

excellent point JB! and even with the rave reviews (i remember you and biggsy both thoroughly enjoying these clubs), how were the sales of that particular iron?

 

[JB]

excellent point JB! and even with the rave reviews (i remember you and biggsy both thoroughly enjoying these clubs), how were the sales of that particular iron?

Average at best. People purchase Mizuno for a certain reason. THEY believe that they are getting better feel out of an iron due to its structure. Whether it is true or not, I cannot answer it for everybody outside of myself. But Mizuno iron players, feel as though they are. Mizuno as a company markets that feel based on their forging process.

When a Mizuno iron comes out that is cast, it will not have the same following in my opinion.

 

[Hanks]

i honestly think that some OEM can really lay claim to a huge forged market, if only they don't price themselves out of it. we'll see i guess.

+100 TC. I think there's an untapped market for forged clubs in this country. If an OEM gets smart and prices itself competitively AND makes the irons playable for all handicappers (or at least mid to low) then they'll win the market segment handily

 

[BDoubleG]

I think I'm finally at a point at which I can pick up something forged, with a little less forgiveness and a little more feel...these may fit the bill perfectly!!

 

[JB]

+100 TC. I think there's an untapped market for forged clubs in this country. If an OEM gets smart and prices itself competitively AND makes the irons playable for all handicappers (or at least mid to low) then they'll win the market segment handily

See, I am at the opposite end of the spectrum with this. Mizuno has had forged clubs on the market at all sorts of price points and their marketshare is no where near what others are. I still think it is a niche market. Now that could COMPLETELY change with TM marketing behind it. But I dont think TM will cut off their bread and butter here which are the Burner iron series. The only iron they have ever had that reached #1 status.

 

[TC]

Average at best. People purchase Mizuno for a certain reason. THEY believe that they are getting better feel out of an iron due to its structure. Whether it is true or not, I cannot answer it for everybody outside of myself. But Mizuno iron players, feel as though they are. Mizuno as a company markets that feel based on their forging process.

When a Mizuno iron comes out that is cast, it will not have the same following in my opinion.

i agree completely with this post. the sad thing is that these sounded to be some very, very good irons but the devouts would never consider them.

+100 TC. I think there's an untapped market for forged clubs in this country. If an OEM gets smart and prices itself competitively AND makes the irons playable for all handicappers (or at least mid to low) then they'll win the market segment handily

dude, i think someone could do very well in this niche. and i'd love to be the consumer who took advantage of it.

 

[Hanks]

agreed but I also think that Mizuno is still not a household name for the casual golfer a la TM, Callaway, Nike, Titleist, etc. This could all change if other OEM's see any glimmer of success being had by a little more mainstream marketing effort for this segment

See, I am at the opposite end of the spectrum with this. Mizuno has had forged clubs on the market at all sorts of price points and their marketshare is no where near what others are. I still think it is a niche market. Now that could COMPLETELY change with TM marketing behind it. But I dont think TM will cut off their bread and butter here which are the Burner iron series. The only iron they have ever had that reached #1 status.

 

[SethO]

I wonder if the American market will go the direction of the Japan market.

JB and I had a good little discussion about cast vs. forged at the outing. I became a huge forged fan after I got my DF's. I would love to know the metal specs of various cast vs. various forged clubs. We hear about 303 stainless, GSS, Carbon steel, etc in the putting world all the time, but all we hear about in the irons world is cast or forged.

 

[JB]

agreed but I also think that Mizuno is still not a household name for the casual golfer a la TM, Callaway, Nike, Titleist, etc. This could all change if other OEM's see any glimmer of success being had by a little more mainstream marketing effort for this segment

Maybe. But I dont see it. The way I see it is differently than most though. I see the best in the world tell us what they think. I see what they are playing and why they are playing them. I see the marketshares of different companies and what is selling. I think there is a SMALL percentage that believe they have something special in their hands. For that I say it is great and it works for them. But I also see the biggest companies in the world going in a different direction since casting technologies have improved.

To me, the niche market will always be there. But the home run and mainstream success lies with other scenarios. Marketing is king in this world. TM will have these in the hands of most of their players come 2011 season. That will hold an influence for sure. People for some reason never want to talk about the tour success equaling direct correlation with consumer purchases. But it does. For proof, look at the Ghost Putter just this year. Look at sales of when it came out compared with after it got a win.

Look at these stats. Most played on tour, drivers, wedges, putters, and golf balls. It is the EXACT same as what is purchase by the consumers in order. Most played wedges on tour are the most purchased wedges by consumers, etc.. etc...

TM will make a strong push for these in their marketing, but I still think that their bread and butter is the amateur golfer and they are not going to risk killing that off.

 

[Hanks]

In addition to marketing, do you think this has to do with 'club visibility?' I think it's easier for an amateur golfer to see what a pro is using for a putter, driver, even wedges but irons tend to be an afterthought because they're not always the 'sexy sticks'

Maybe. But I dont see it. The way I see it is differently than most though. I see the best in the world tell us what they think. I see what they are playing and why they are playing them. I see the marketshares of different companies and what is selling. I think there is a SMALL percentage that believe they have something special in their hands. For that I say it is great and it works for them. But I also see the biggest companies in the world going in a different direction since casting technologies have improved.

To me, the niche market will always be there. But the home run and mainstream success lies with other scenarios. Marketing is king in this world. TM will have these in the hands of most of their players come 2011 season. That will hold an influence for sure. People for some reason never want to talk about the tour success equaling direct correlation with consumer purchases. But it does. For proof, look at the Ghost Putter just this year. Look at sales of when it came out compared with after it got a win.

Look at these stats. Most played on tour, drivers, wedges, putters, and golf balls. It is the EXACT same as what is purchase by the consumers in order. Most played wedges on tour are the most purchased wedges by consumers, etc.. etc...

TM will make a strong push for these in their marketing, but I still think that their bread and butter is the amateur golfer and they are not going to risk killing that off.

 

[Hawk]

I don't think the forged market will ever be huge in the US. Not that TM can't get some interest going and take over what is already out there.

 

[JB]

In addition to marketing, do you think this has to do with 'club visibility?' I think it's easier for an amateur golfer to see what a pro is using for a putter, driver, even wedges but irons tend to be an afterthought because they're not always the 'sexy sticks'

Possibly. But even irons have the direct correlation to the company, but because the irons are not the same, they often dont publicize it as much (changing recently). We have spoken to hundreds of tour pros and we almost always ask about the "feel" of their clubs. Heck tons of players addressed this in the videos we shot with the TM guys about the R9 TP irons. I wont turn this into cast vs forged, because it does not need to be a debate. But I will say that company marketing plays a HUGE role in how clubs are perceived. And in the end, perception is all we have right?

 

[BDoubleG]

Average at best. People purchase Mizuno for a certain reason. THEY believe that they are getting better feel out of an iron due to its structure. Whether it is true or not, I cannot answer it for everybody outside of myself. But Mizuno iron players, feel as though they are. Mizuno as a company markets that feel based on their forging process.

When a Mizuno iron comes out that is cast, it will not have the same following in my opinion.

Well the new JP is cast...I'm interested in seeing how it sells. Hit it the other day and came away pretty underwhelmed...

 

[JB]

Well the new JP is cast...I'm interested in seeing how it sells. Hit it the other day and came away pretty underwhelmed...

Just as the MX-1000 was. Heck its a very similar club.

I actually think the new JPX felt great to me. In fact I felt as though it was darn similar to the pro series. But I dont think either will do that well on the marketplace.