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inthehole

inthehole

Holly Sonders Caddie
Joined
Feb 5, 2012
Messages
780
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Location
Pocono's PA
Handicap
GHIN 11.5
I'm not a great player, but have worked my way up to being fairly decent. I've worked the hardest on my pitching & chipping and consider it to be my strong suit. So .....

I just don't understand the need to use spin on the green. I hit my chips and pitches nice and crisp, and judge the roll out and unless something really unusual happens, can usually get it fairly tight (giving myself at least a fair shot at making the putt).

I generate NO SPIN WHATSOEVER.

Therefore, I'm plenty comfortable using distance balls. I see all the talk ad nauseum from guys trying this permium ball, comparing it to that tour ball, praising the feel of that spinny ball, etc etc ... it just doesn't compute to me. Sure, some balls feel different - some are more clicky, some are softer ... but I just don't get the seeming total obsession alot of golfers have with paying alot of money for balls that spin / check.

Maybe it's because I don't play with low hcp players who are proficient at this type of shot and could take advantage of a tour ball ... I have always played with guys roughly of my hcp - better than average players, but none of whom really spin the ball much.

Serious question ... what is the deal with playing an expensive ball that checks up on the green, when you can hit a chip / pitch that can roll up just as close (given equal talent) ? Seems to me generating green side spin takes a much more aggressive swing, and the potential for disaster is far greater if the shot is not executed well.

Please, this is bugging the crap outa me ... really ... I'd love to hear candid comments on what exactly is the advantage to using a spinny ball in your game ? Before everybody says it's all about "control" or "feel" ... I have a hard time with this, as I have plenty of control/feel over my running chip / pitch shots if I properly execute without using a tour ball. Sorry for my semi-rant, but I'd really like to understand the rationale from the guys who use better balls ... thanks
 
if i can't answer w/ Control or feel, I got nothing....those are my reasons
 
I am a highish spin player. Those better balls allow me to spin it less of the tee and still get a fair amount of spin going into the greens. I prefer urethane covered golf balls, not necessarily tour level balls.
 
I've never understood cheap versus expensive balls either. If I hit the ball well then the ball goes so as it doesn't fall apart on me I'm good with whatever. Cheaper the better that way I don't get more irritated when I lose one. I haven't been able to generate spin on the ball either and I'm ok with it. This is kind of the same thing I have with a bonded driver versus adjustable. Just hit the ball correctly and the ball will go.
 
Here are a couple thoughts...

1 - You definitely spin the ball... I'm not sure I've ever seen someone hit a golf ball with zero spin on it -- That's probably not what you're trying to say, but worth noting.

2 - For a while I agreed with you... until I started facing questionable lies or ultra tight pin placements. I'll absolutely agree, on a golf course with big greens and the pin in the middle of them, you can get away without getting spin creative, but there are just moments where the only play is to get it on the green with a ton of action to slow it down.

3 - By generating solid stopping power with backspin, you have the ability to get quite a bit more aggressive on the shot. This is awesome for tough lies, where taking a casual swipe at the ball simply won't get the job done.

I've been known to just play a flop, but after working hard on my short game, I see so much value in having many different shots available. I think it depends on the scenario, but I definitely think spin is a very important tool greenside.
 
I couldn't imagine trying to play certain shots with no spin or little spin as you say. Some pins just call for it
 
I agree with Dan's points. It's great on a big wide open course but what happens if there is trouble between you and the hole like a bunker or something. Do you just try to run it through the bunker. I will say most players don't get it on the ground soon enough so I like your overall thinking but you do need a few other shots and overall the better balls will give you more options


Proud Member of #TeamParadise
 
Playing courses and greens that are receptive to letting the ball run out it and being able to do so is fine.

But leaving your self short sided or pins at the front of the green require the ability to get the ball to stop quickly.

Not to mention landing the ball on a down hill slope on and the only way to slow it down from running off the green is a ton of spin.

I don't hit the high spin shot a lot but I can and will use it when necessary.
 
golfinFF said:
Playing courses and greens that are receptive to letting the ball run out it and being able to do so is fine.

But leaving your self short sided or pins at the front of the green require the ability to get the ball to stop quickly.

Not to mention landing the ball on a down hill slope on and the only way to slow it down from running off the green is a ton of spin.

I don't hit the high spin shot a lot but I can and will use it when necessary.
Click to expand...
First thing that comes to my mind is hitting over a bunker to a down hill pin and trouble off the back of the green. Spin is a must
 
I'd say try running a ball onto a green with some severe down slope and you'll wish you could check it up.
 
When the USGA decided to screw us over groove wise, I was forced to buy v grooved clubs because I wanted new irons. With my old irons and wedges, I could stop a Top Flight and go at most pins dead on. Now being forced to play clubs with a lot less spin, I go with balls that offer less spin for driver/long shot reasons and I've had to relearn the game inside 100 yards which is still a work in progress. Every approach shot is going to run for me now with the grooves being what they are, so I just play lower running shots now more than ever. This change has hurt my index big time and has changed the way I approach every round. If things don't get better soon, I'll ditch all the clubs in my bag and go back to the old ones which I'm lucky to have several sets of.
 
My home course has small greens and most of them are elevated, so hitting better balls that spin more are a big help.
On some other courses I've played with bigger and/or greens that are ground level, I have no problem playing a lower spin ball and hitting shots to the pin with more roll.
 
I dont think anyone really needs to give an answer as to how they like to spend their money on their own hobby. If they feel more comfortable with a certain peice of equipment and can afford it then why not? I really don tcare what you like or why you play or how you pay for it. Thats just me though. Just for reference I buy high end balls when they go on sale.
 
On full shots, I see little to no difference between the ProV1s I play and say, a noodle long and soft. That's on every club. Even full wedges into my home course greens, it's about the same. However, I have tried lots of balls, and play plenty of "cheap" balls I find laying around. It is the 10-50 yard pitch shot that I see the benefit of the spinny expensive balls. My greens are really small, and when they get firm, if I try a 30 yard pitch with a cheap ball, it may hit the front edge and roll clear across and off the green. The expensive spinny balls help with some of that problem.

~Rock
 
I think having the ability to spin the ball is HUGE! Unfortunately, I've never been able to spin a ball on purpose and get it to check up as I wished. I've hit a couple out of the sand that have danced a little, but that's about it. That certainly would be a benefit I'd cherish!
 
If you play a course with pretty flat, large greens, then there really is no benefit to playing a ball that spins a lot.
But, as others have said, playing fast, undulating greens with tight pin placements is a different story.
I would suggest that you play golf with some better players at other, tougher courses around where you live, and you might see different results with chip shots.
I personally play a soft-ish ball when my approach shots need to stay on the green. While I know that some golf balls will run more than others, it is really nice to know, and a big confidence boost, that when I hit a 7 or 8 iron onto the green, it will be in the general vicinity of where it lands, and won't often run through the green, leaving me with a pitch rather than a putt.
I hope that makes sense.
 
The benefit to me in using some additional spin is also really on chipping and pitching. Although we all benefit from more spin out of good lies versus less spin out of rough in terms of holding the green--no matter what ball you use, you are likely getting a decent amount of spin if you were to put it on a monitor.

The groove rule came about because of the ability to use high spin from many lies to a huge advantage--so although there are lower spin alternatives to getting the ball to the hole, the ability to stick the ball close and have it stop for a tough green is a key to scoring better in terms of proximity to the hole.
 
Thanks everybody - all the answers helped me understand the whole concept of why spin is necessary and considered an advantage, especially green side.
 
OP, you have never been short-sided? You have never hit to a front pin? Spin allows you to go more aggresively at a pin, esp with wedges. Ability to spin gives you more options, because the ability to spin the ball doesn't mean you have to. If you want roll, just use a less lofted club with a slower swing, and that way you have both types of shots in your bag instead of just one.

Also, I have found that spin is more of a function of a clean strike with a descending path and forward lean and good clubhead speed than what type of ball is used. I was amazed when I started using TF Gamers and they were spinning back three ft (just as much as a PV1) with a 50 yd shot.
 
This reminds me of a show that was on the golf channel years ago. Pros would be on live taking calls and answering questions.

Gary Player was the guest one week. Someone called and asked how Mr. Player was able to spin back a five iron.

Mr. Player asked, "How far do you hit your five iron?"

"About 150."

"Why on earth do you want to back it up?"
 
thug the bunny said:
OP, you have never been short-sided? You have never hit to a front pin? Spin allows you to go more aggresively at a pin, esp with wedges.
Click to expand...

Honestly, I use a 64° for those common short sided greenside shots - I have practiced and am pretty good at those little pop "feel" shots (and the full lob shots, but have learned to limit those to only when absolutely necessary). As I don't really spin the ball, I found that ultra lob wedge gives me the best chance at not running by pins.

Apparently, the consensus is its just easier with a spinny ball - I can usually get by with the ultra lob, but maybe I'm making it harder than it needs to be. OK OK, I give ... I will give better balls a fair chance - as I realize I'm definitely in the minority using only distance balls ...
 
I'm in the same boat. A full-shot, high and well-struck ball with my Trusty Rusty lob wedge...rolls out a couple of feet. With the SR2 ball.

I'm sure there are tutorials out there for how to generate more spin, but I haven't found them, or I don't play into greens at the right angle, or something...My balls check a bit more into greens, but that's about it. But a full gap wedge or sand wedge, at best it spins in based on the kick of the green.

Sometimes I feel like there's some talisman out there I just haven't found, but for the most part I think it's a matter of ball striking into parts of the green that promote the spinning back of the ball. Though, to be honest, at this point in my game, I'm worried about straight, then draw/fade, then spinning back, then spinning draw/fade. It's cool when I stick a wedge, but cooler still when I hit it the direction I like.
 
To me this is the same kind of question as asking why anyone would ever try to hit a draw or a fade on purpose rather than simply hitting everything straight. Players at a certain level would probably be better off not trying to spin the ball too much just as they would probably be better off not trying to shape their shots. That said, at a certain level those are the things that start to make a big difference in ability to score. Trying to play the crowd pleasing one hop and stop low spinner every single time is not a great strategy, but it certainly has its uses.
 
I think that having a ball that will respond to proper technique and spin when commanded just gives the golfer another option. I will play shots that get down early and roll out to the pin. Occasionally one is faced with the situation where flying it to the pin and having it "one hop and stop" is essential. I also think the shot where you hit down and impart a lot of spin is easier and has more margin for error. IMO a ball that will react completely to the golfer allows the player to fully express their short game creativity.
 
I can usually use any ball and get similar results on most shots, but there always ends up being 3-8 times in my round when I need a ball to stop quickly... I do play rollout type chips the majority of the time, every time it's feasible, but I can assure you that at least once I am going to have to carry over a bunker to a tight pin...need a ball that stops for that.

My course always has hard fast greens during most of the playing season, but the fringe and grass surrounding the greens is a different story. Very rarely is putting from off the green an option...the ball just goes crazy when it tries to roll through the fringe...it may stop, it may jump 30 degrees either way...you never know. I prefer to chip with a mid iron if I'm really close to the green, or pitch with a short iron/PW if I am 10 or more yards off... if I have lots of green to work with playing a runout shot is my choice, but several times I leave myself with 20-40 feet of grass to carry and only 10-12 feet of green surface between me and the hole....I need a ball that will hit once, bounce, and stop when it hits the ground again for these shots..

And there is nothing that makes me madder than hitting a beautiful, high flying 8 iron-PW that hits within 10 feet of the flag and then bounces and rolls all the way out the back door, and I find that happening much more often when I am playing a ball that doesn't generate as much greenside spin.
 
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