I just completed my 35th driver fitting in the last two months now that I was dragged back into clubfitting. What I have seen is that if you were well fit into a driver in the last 3-4 years, you likely will not see much improvement in the newest lines. Older than that, the differences will start to register on a launch monitor, especially on moderate misses.
Do You Believe The Hype?
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- #27
Im not sure. Bubble Burner Ti was pretty mainstream and $400 in 1995 I believe.
Sure you can go to the exotic Japanese brands like XXIO and Majesty or the odd duck that is PXG.
But most of the mainstream drivers fall between $400 and $550.
Using the #1 sellers in 1995 through 1997 we ranged from $350 to $450.
In 2019 it was $529. To me that doesn’t seem outrageous.
In 2007 the iPhone was released for $499. In 2019, it went DOWN in price to $699. Being that these are both products that many exchange every couple of years, it seems rather similar. And that was only 12 years ago.
We happened to have a downturn in costs for a short period of time where drivers were $300 in the early to mid 2000s, but drivers have always been expensive.
Yeah that sounds about right. That period in the early 2000's is about as far back as I can remember pricing wise and I remember pretty much everything being 299-349. Considering the 2007 Burner I purchased new was $299, 75% inflation over a 12 year span seems like a bunch. It seems like prices jumped when they went to adjustable hosels, then jumped again about 3 years ago. Right or wrong, as a consumer, that's how I see it.
i wonder how much the big boys were spending on r&d back then. my point being if drivers are the same or even less now adjusted for inflation, i wonder whether costs, both variable and fixed, have decreased as well. they sure as sh1t haven’t decreased for my business.
coming off the grandaddy and seeing the prototype facility at callaway hq, it never ceases to amaze me just how much money golf companies spend to try to figure out how to improve their products. and yet people still find something to b1tch about.
they did the math
and i would argue that the inputs and materials that go into the construction are more expensive and sophisticated now than 20 years ago.
I'm sure they are. But wouldn't that be part of the inflation equation?
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Like everything club performance is going to be so different for each person that the hype may help or hurt each person differently. Maybe the changes in driver X in 2019 work for John where next year's model Y doesn't because of new changes. Plus there's the mental factor. If Ping adds 3 inch tall Turbulators to it's driver and that makes John feel more confident standing over the ball then the hype was real and effective for John.
I'm still stuck back in 2016 with the Cobra LTD, what is this "new tech" you all speak of?....I need to try some.
Real talk though, won't companies eventually get to a point that rules and regulations hinder an advancement on preformance? I could be wrong, but.....then what? New paint jobs will be latest and greatest?
Real talk though, won't companies eventually get to a point that rules and regulations hinder an advancement on preformance? I could be wrong, but.....then what? New paint jobs will be latest and greatest?
i don’t think the race is as much about optimizing center strike performance. it’s about maximizing distance and accuracy on mishits. i think there’s plenty of room to grow there. but advances in materials and ai are also assisting the engineering.
I get it.
Companies need something to keep people intetested and buying there products right. Reality is that at some point advancements will stop, ideas will run out, and so on. Obviously this is only my thought, and yes I'm am jealous of those using the newest of new.
but haven’t they been continuing to engineer clubs for the past 50 years? why does there have to be any limit?
epic flash is the first product built with machine learning. and that is only one release removed now that mavrik has been announced. have we already tapped out the boundaries of ai’s capabilities in just one release?
we are no longer bound by our own imaginations. the machines will only get smarter. and when materials are improving, and new processes like 3d printing continue to evolve, i feel like we’re just scratching the surface.
I hear ya man, I have no disagreements as to what your saying. The technology that is out there is unbelievable. I'm only commenting that at some point performance limits will be reached and the only changes will be cosmetic. The OP's post was about the F9 and the SZ drivers being compared, I watched the video in question and thought they had very comparable numbers. Is Cobra at that performance limit already and now can only make cosmetic alterations?? I sure don't know, and am probably thinking way to much about this. Sorry for the long rambley read everyone! It's been a long day. Wish I had a golden ticket in my pocket.
That’s a good one to be stuck on. But I don’t think great minds will run out of ways to be creative and push limits
While I think that marketing in golf can sometimes lay it on a little thick, I wouldn't call it hype.
Any time I go in to test a club I have pretty average expectations. It's fun to be impressed by great gear but I dont expect to be blown away year over year.
Any time I go in to test a club I have pretty average expectations. It's fun to be impressed by great gear but I dont expect to be blown away year over year.
As others have already pointed out, the great advancement is performance on missed strikes. Another YouTube review did a comparison of the F9 and the SpeedZone. This reviewer also had the F9 in his bag last year. This reviewer was very impressed because he claimed his ball strikes with the SpeedZone were much lower quality than with the F9 and yet the numbers were very similar.
I need the help on my misses. Center strikes are rewarding with most any club. I left golf for about 7 years, from 2009 to 2016. I could not believe how much better the equipment was when I returned to the game. I have no doubt that the equipment is improving incrementally.
I need the help on my misses. Center strikes are rewarding with most any club. I left golf for about 7 years, from 2009 to 2016. I could not believe how much better the equipment was when I returned to the game. I have no doubt that the equipment is improving incrementally.
I put zero into any distance claims as I feel now that distance realized is more a marrying of the right fit for clubhead/shaft wrt a particular golfer than any one magic wand for all.
Tech, as it relates to forgiveness, now that gets my attention.
Tech, as it relates to forgiveness, now that gets my attention.
i refuse to believe this. history doesn’t support that conclusion. and we will all benefit from the ongoing innovation.
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- #43
I will never understand how in a day and age when we have tour level fitting at our finger tips, why reviews that feature a handful of shots hit on the button are useful so sought after. Golfers, including tour players, use the entire face. So why spend so much energy focusing on the area that is and has a limit achieved.
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- #44
There are several sub 500 options out there still, that are still high end.
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- #45
I've come to realize some people will cut off their nose to spite their face. To me the idea that innovation will cease to exist is doing just this.
I have pretty much stopped watching review videos like this as they are often done by people who can strike the sweet spot of the club most of the time - Occasionally there will be some big jumps in performance, but I feel that lately that has dropped off to incremental improvements
For me, I feel the improvements now are about retaining ball speed on off-centre hits and keeping the ball in play, for example TM and their Twistface to help reduce curvature on the bad hits
This, to me, is where the hype is to be focussed and demonstrate to the consumers that on perfect strikes you may not see much, if any, of an improvement, but that bad strikes will not see as much of a drop off as previous models
For me, I feel the improvements now are about retaining ball speed on off-centre hits and keeping the ball in play, for example TM and their Twistface to help reduce curvature on the bad hits
This, to me, is where the hype is to be focussed and demonstrate to the consumers that on perfect strikes you may not see much, if any, of an improvement, but that bad strikes will not see as much of a drop off as previous models
I think it is unusual for their to be a massive jump year to year in clubs, especially from teh same manufacturer, especially with the rules on equipment being so stringent.
That being said, manufacturers do make improvements and they do help us, but my cycle for equipment is probably 2 years, unless there is something world changing, that changes my world, that comes out.
That being said, manufacturers do make improvements and they do help us, but my cycle for equipment is probably 2 years, unless there is something world changing, that changes my world, that comes out.
Thank goodness people embraced technology and R and D after the wright brothers initial flight
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I have a feeling that I didn't word my comments properly McLovin. I apologize to all those that read them. I'm comparing A driver to other sporting equipment I have that has to conform to ball speed limits. The tech there has reached a point of being topped out with mph velocity so what's left for R&D is cosmetic changes, materials, and so one. Very different sport and I should have kept to my self.
and I think mine came across like I was mad haha
no apologies needed! i'll say this: i HOPE you're wrong lol because if you're right, i will never get better. i need equipment improvements to improve my game!!!