Michael Breed leaving Golfchannel?

[ChristopherKee]

Does Foley get a bad rap for supposedly causing injury to his players with his swing principles or is there some truth in it?

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Truth in it will injure you? I would say it will injure you no more than the old school reverse C swing, or the Butch Harmon era swing of restricting the hip turn to add "torque". The sequencing of stack and tilt style swings is pretty simple and relatively easy on the body. If you try to enter a long drive contest with it you'll lose as hitting things really far is better off with a technique even pros don't really use.

I spent a good amount of time with the Foley swing and it wasn't hard on the body at all. The most damage I ever did with a "swing technique" would be snapping my left leg like Tiger used to. I'm still recovering from that years later.

 

[Tadashi70]

Does Foley get a bad rap for supposedly causing injury to his players with his swing principles or is there some truth in it?

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Foley would never have been in the crosshairs had he not taken on Tiger as a student. Before tiger, very few knew who he was.

He taught under Phil Ritson for years and worked closely with a few Koreans that have since made their mark on tour. He is very knowledgeable and quite a joy to be around. He doesn’t hesitate to tell what he thinks which I think rubs some the wrong way.

As to his swing method causing injury, I don’t think it does any more than Harmon’s or Haney’s or McClains.

 

[moosejaa]

@ChristopherKee and @Tadashi70 ...thanks for the insight, very interesting.

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[JB]

Foley would never have been in the crosshairs had he not taken on Tiger as a student. Before tiger, very few knew who he was.

He taught under Phil Ritson for years and worked closely with a few Koreans that have since made their mark on tour. He is very knowledgeable and quite a joy to be around. He doesn’t hesitate to tell what he thinks which I think rubs some the wrong way.

As to his swing method causing injury, I don’t think it does any more than Harmon’s or Haney’s or McClains.

Im not sure I agree with that. He had a player leave and say it caused issues. Does Tiger add more eyeballs? Of course, but he had a stable of tour players, more than half of them moved on. It doesn't make him a bad teacher, but between that and rubbing some the wrong way, it comes with the territory. No different really than Tiger fans, all of the sudden hating his former teacher, after a split.

Top 100 teachers have a way of getting noticed, due to their constant tips in the traditional publications.

I will add that the same amount of people that notice him now because of Tiger, only became a fan of his because of Tiger, right?

 

[Tadashi70]

Im not sure I agree with that. He had a player leave and say it caused issues. Does Tiger add more eyeballs? Of course, but he had a stable of tour players, more than half of them moved on. It doesn't make him a bad teacher, but between that and rubbing some the wrong way, it comes with the territory. No different really than Tiger fans, all of the sudden hating his former teacher, after a split.

Top 100 teachers have a way of getting noticed, due to their constant tips in the traditional publications.

I will add that the same amount of people that notice him now because of Tiger, only became a fan of his because of Tiger, right?

Players leave teachers all the time for one reason or another. Norman left Harmon for Leadbetter. He has had back issues. Does that mean Harmon’s swing creates back problems, no. Same goes for SF.

You are right, fans of Foley’s are due to his time with TW. Not all but new fans.

I’ll add this, his work with KJ Choi caught my eye in the early 2000s. When TW picked him as a coach it caught me off guard. This is to say, he flew under the radar for a long time in the teaching world.

 

[Kujan]

As I see it, losing Breed is no big loss. Just as many people seemed to be turned off by his approach as did those who were fans of it and I for one look forward to a less fast-paced and less all over the place approach.

Agreed.

 

[JB]

Players leave teachers all the time for one reason or another. Norman left Harmon for Leadbetter. He has had back issues. Does that mean Harmon’s swing creates back problems, no. Same goes for SF.

You are right, fans of Foley’s are due to his time with TW. Not all but new fans.

I’ll add this, his work with KJ Choi caught my eye in the early 2000s. When TW picked him as a coach it caught me off guard. This is to say, he flew under the radar for a long time in the teaching world.

But Norman didnt then blame the back issues on Harmon. That happened in this case. Is it right? Maybe, maybe not. But it happened.
Every teach TW has gone to had furthered his career and winning. In this case that went the opposite way and injuries mounted. Coincidence? Maybe also.

 

[crazygolfnut]

Stopped watching Michael Breed a long time ago. Just could not listen to him very long. I am hoping that a new announcer might bring me back to the show.

 

[McLovin]

But Norman didnt then blame the back issues on Harmon. That happened in this case. Is it right? Maybe, maybe not. But it happened.
Every teach TW has gone to had furthered his career and winning. In this case that went the opposite way and injuries mounted. Coincidence? Maybe also.

the hard part about the foley time is that we don’t know what tiger had already done and continued to do to his body in the lead up. haney talks about what tiger was doing to his body under his tutelage and how haney had concerns. it seems entirely reasonable that tiger was on the cusp of major injury before going to foley, and continued to exacerbate the damage while with foley.

he still won 8 times with foley. no, that wasn’t better than with haney or harmon. but it’s not like he stopped being able to play golf. he was also on a really strong trajectory in 2013 (poy iirc) with foley before injuring that elbow and then parted ways.


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[jhtr20]

I like Breed. Like any on TV instructor you need to take what you need and leave the rest. I thought he was entertaining. It will be interesting to see how Foley does. Is this going to be Revolution golf for free?

 

[JB]

the hard part about the foley time is that we don’t know what tiger had already done and continued to do to his body in the lead up. haney talks about what tiger was doing to his body under his tutelage and how haney had concerns. it seems entirely reasonable that tiger was on the cusp of major injury before going to foley, and continued to exacerbate the damage while with foley.

he still won 8 times with foley. no, that wasn’t better than with haney or harmon. but it’s not like he stopped being able to play golf. he was also on a really strong trajectory in 2013 (poy iirc) with foley before injuring that elbow and then parted ways.


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I dont disagree with that. We dont know, but its completely assumed that there is no correlation, when there has been precedent set that it could cause issues at that level. The one thing is that is rather unique in this situation is at each level, he was a strong dominant player. With each change, his die hand fans bashed the previous coach. Yet in this instance, its different because he became one of the pack...Its human nature I guess, but its definitely interesting to follow. You could make the case that not a single player at that level got better under Foley, right?

Rose joined him in 09 and he was already pretty strong, but he might be the outlier. Im not making that argument because honestly I dont care who teaches these guys and not sure how much it impacts finishes at that level, but the defense is ONLY there because he was the coach of Tiger Woods in my opinion, which as mentioned above, goes against how the fans treated his last two big names.

 

[tequila4kapp]

Foley would never have been in the crosshairs had he not taken on Tiger as a student. Before tiger, very few knew who he was.

He taught under Phil Ritson for years and worked closely with a few Koreans that have since made their mark on tour. He is very knowledgeable and quite a joy to be around. He doesn’t hesitate to tell what he thinks which I think rubs some the wrong way.

As to his swing method causing injury, I don’t think it does any more than Harmon’s or Haney’s or McClains.

He rubs me the wrong way not because of Tiger or the injury thing but because I've perceived in him a mix of new age mumbo jumbo and arrogance. I recall one of his students commenting that Tiger (?) didn't understand the most basic things about the golf swing. That wasn't Foley per say but it was indicative of that notion that he and his teaching methods are so brilliant and everyone else is a dolt.

 

[Tadashi70]

He rubs me the wrong way not because of Tiger or the injury thing but because I've perceived in him a mix of new age mumbo jumbo and arrogance. I recall one of his students commenting that Tiger (?) didn't understand the most basic things about the golf swing. That wasn't Foley per say but it was indicative of that notion that he and his teaching methods are so brilliant and everyone else is a dolt.

I know he rubs people wrong. He isn’t for everyone, I get that. He is very smart and confident. But he is just like one of the guys when you get to know him.