My Recent Club Champion Fitting Experience - I may be getting some new clubs.....

[BigE]

Sounds like you ended up with a solid fitting but that's far too expensive for those irons. You better go ahead and order those elsewhere and have them built at another shop if you like them. CC wanted to charge me $800 more for the EXACT same set of P770s as a local shop, actually absurd.

I'm not sure going elsewhere to have the clubs built is all that much cheaper.
See my cost analysis on post 48.
Cost for my Callaway DCB irons through CC (assumes no puring or taxes): $2,499
Cost if I were to source the components myself and have someone else build: $2,416
An $83 savings to build elsewhere.
Which I believe CC makes up for with their guaranteed fit (will fix for free if something doesn't work), their free simulator time for customers ($150 value), 0% 18 month loan for the cost of the clubs, free annual loft and lie adjustments, future discounts on fittings.

 

[nicklongdrive]

I'm not sure going elsewhere to have the clubs built is all that much cheaper.
See my cost analysis on post 48.
Cost for my Callaway DCB irons through CC (assumes no puring or taxes): $2,499
Cost if I were to source the components myself and have someone else build: $2,416
An $83 savings to build elsewhere.
Which I believe CC makes up for with their guaranteed fit (will fix for free if something doesn't work), their free simulator time for customers ($150 value), 0% 18 month loan for the cost of the clubs, free annual loft and lie adjustments, future discounts on fittings.

Justify it however you like but the Paderson shafts don't cost that much each nor do the DCB heads cost that much either. If you are being cost conscious get some other quotes because that price is absurd. I paid $1400 for my P770s 4-PW with C-Taper Lites and Golf Pride MCC+4 Midsize grips, not to mention puring is almost a scam as it is pretty much indiscernible to the amateur golfer (if the manufacturer's tolerances are TIGHT): this video addresses it directly.

 

[russtopher]

Justify it however you like but the Paderson shafts don't cost that much each nor do the DCB heads cost that much either. If you are being cost conscious get some other quotes because that price is absurd. I paid $1400 for my P770s 4-PW with C-Taper Lites and Golf Pride MCC+4 Midsize grips, not to mention puring is almost a scam as it is pretty much indiscernible to the amateur golfer (if the manufacturer's tolerances are TIGHT): this video addresses it directly.

I don't feel like that's the best comparison given it's completely different heads and shafts that you're comparing the pricing of. In the end, it was BigE's fitting and his decision to spend what he personally felt was a reasonable price. He did the research and that justified the cost to him. That's all that matters.

 

[BigE]

Justify it however you like but the Paderson shafts don't cost that much each nor do the DCB heads cost that much either. If you are being cost conscious get some other quotes because that price is absurd. I paid $1400 for my P770s 4-PW with C-Taper Lites and Golf Pride MCC+4 Midsize grips, not to mention puring is almost a scam as it is pretty much indiscernible to the amateur golfer (if the manufacturer's tolerances are TIGHT): this video addresses it directly.

I got the cost of the Paderson Shafts ($80) right off the Paderson website.
And if you called Callaway and only wanted the "heads", you'd pay the same for the "heads only" as you would for the assembled clubs.
And puring wasn't included in my cost analysis because it's only a CC option. If you don't see the value of it, you can decline that option.

 

[nicklongdrive]

I got the cost of the Paderson Shafts ($80) right off the Paderson website.
And if you called Callaway and only wanted the "heads", you'd pay the same for the "heads only" as you would for the assembled clubs.
And puring wasn't included in my cost analysis because it's only a CC option. If you don't see the value of it, you can decline that option.

Once again, you call a shop to build you the same set (my local shop Golfdom in Tysons Corner, VA) and I guarantee you they are not quoting $2400 for those clubs. You're not a shop so of course you ask to purchase the components they aren't giving you the best price, lol. I urge you to give them a call and see if they can help you out.

My father and I went through this same process with a set of ZX5s and my P770s (I also priced out a set of T200s at the time) and undoubtedly the price was still much cheaper going elsewhere. I'm just letting you know that if you do the due diligence you will most likely see what I saw. Callaway isn't more costly than TMs, the only thing much different is my shafts are cheaper but that's not the bulk of the cost.

Also, you said the Padersons were $80 off the site and $135/ea from CC, that doesn't irk you?

 

[4hourrule]

Driver is 10.5 (with a 45.5 inch R shaft). 4w is 16 degrees (with a 43 inch S shaft). Hybrid is 19 degree (with a 40 R inch shaft).
You may be right on the 3W. That'll be part of what I check out with my fitter on Monday.
Although my experience in the past is that at my age (63), the extra little launch I get with the 4w loft gives me better distance than the 3W with 15 degree loft.
I'm also thinking, as I mentioned before, that perhaps an R flex might help?
Or heck, I'm finding I really love the Srixon ZX hybrid - maybe I should consider taking the FW Wood out of the bag altogether and get another Srixon Hybrid at 15 degrees.
It'll be an interesting problem to solve.

Now that I am correcting my bad back swing my Woods are totally pooched for proper contact. I picked up last gen ZX utilities (U85) 6 and 4irons and love them. I am waiting for a used 5 U85 next. These Utes are fantastic in the wind.

 

[4hourrule]

Now that I am correcting my bad back swing my Woods are totally pooched for proper contact. I picked up last gen ZX utilities (U85) 6 and 4irons and love them. I am waiting for a used 5 U85 next. These Utes are fantastic in the wind.

I have heard the ZX Utes are even better

 

[BigE]

Once again, you call a shop to build you the same set (my local shop Golfdom in Tysons Corner, VA) and I guarantee you they are not quoting $2400 for those clubs. You're not a shop so of course you ask to purchase the components they aren't giving you the best price, lol. I urge you to give them a call and see if they can help you out.

My father and I went through this same process with a set of ZX5s and my P770s (I also priced out a set of T200s at the time) and undoubtedly the price was still much cheaper going elsewhere. I'm just letting you know that if you do the due diligence you will most likely see what I saw. Callaway isn't more costly than TMs, the only thing much different is my shafts are cheaper but that's not the bulk of the cost.

Also, you said the Padersons were $80 off the site and $135/ea from CC, that doesn't irk you?

I don't see how if I called a local shop to build me some Callaway DCB irons with Paderson Shafts that they could come in significantly cheaper than CC given the cost to purchase the material is identical. The starting point would be the same $1,295 for the club heads + $560 for the shafts + at least $70 for the grips = $1,925 or a little under $2k.

Now of course the local club builder could be cheaper if he uses a less expensive shaft that he feels would perform the same as the Paderson shafts - but that's a different discussion. That then becomes how much value do boutique (or more expensive) shafts add to performance vs standard shafts provided by a manufacturer.

And no, the $135 doesn't irk me. The $135 (quoted by CC) is the $80 material cost of the shaft + $55 to assemble and inspect. In other words, the $135 shaft price is simply where CC buries their cost to build the clubs.

If I missed something in my analysis please show me where. Just saying you know you can call a local shop and do better without identifying WHERE they can do better doesn't explain where CC is supposedly overcharging in their quotes.




Given the material costs, you haven't really explained to me how a local builder could be "significantly cheaper" - unless of course he was willing to sell at a loss, or as I said before, would swap out heads or shafts for something cheaper that they feel performs as well.

 

[BigE]

I have heard the ZX Utes are even better

I'm absolutely crushing the 19 degee I have. I love both the look and feel.
If I can't solve my 3W gapping problem - I might take a look at the ZX 15 degree hybrid!

 

[BigE]

How far are you carrying your 6i now? I am right around 78-81 mph depending on how loose my body is that day and I am in the 160-163 carry distance. My driver SS is in the same range with shorter carry distance but I know that is a swing flaw given that I hit down on the driver.

Went to the simulator today.......recorded the data for 7 shots with my six iron.
Swing speed was in the mid 80's, average carry was around 160 yds, total distance 172 yds
Gapping between the Hybrid and my 4W was much better today (maybe I just need to get used to the clubs?) as I was hitting my 4 hybrid 200 yds and my 4 wood 215 yds.

 

[etakmit]

Hey another Rochesterian! From a personal perspective standpoint I prefer Pennfair golf over CC but it's purely preference. My biggest reason for that is communication issues I had with CC early this year (i.e. I could not get a single person to call me back from the Victor location and the three times I stopped in during their "open" hours the doors were locked with the lights off - midday outside of the lunch hour).

I'm glad you found a set that works great for you - I'm in the market for new irons next spring - we'll see where I go with that.

 

[Chef23]

Went to the simulator today.......recorded the data for 7 shots with my six iron.
Swing speed was in the mid 80's, average carry was around 160 yds, total distance 172 yds
Gapping between the Hybrid and my 4W was much better today (maybe I just need to get used to the clubs?) as I was hitting my 4 hybrid 200 yds and my 4 wood 215 yds.

That makes good sense. With a 6i my swing speed is 80-81 mph and I carry the 6i right around 160 yards. I don't find that on the course the ball rolls out quite as much as it does on the simulator. I would say 5-7 yards most of the time as opposed to 12.

Are the 4 hybrid and 4 wood numbers total or carry?

 

[BigE]

That makes good sense. With a 6i my swing speed is 80-81 mph and I carry the 6i right around 160 yards. I don't find that on the course the ball rolls out quite as much as it does on the simulator. I would say 5-7 yards most of the time as opposed to 12.

Are the 4 hybrid and 4 wood numbers total or carry?

I always think in terms of total distance (since I can verify that of the course....)
So yes, 200 in total distance for the hybrid and 215 for the 4W.

 

[Chef23]

I always think in terms of total distance (since I can verify that of the course....)
So yes, 200 in total distance for the hybrid and 215 for the 4W.

I always think in terms of carry distance. If there is a hazard I want to know how far to cover it.

 

[BigE]

Hey another Rochesterian! From a personal perspective standpoint I prefer Pennfair golf over CC but it's purely preference. My biggest reason for that is communication issues I had with CC early this year (i.e. I could not get a single person to call me back from the Victor location and the three times I stopped in during their "open" hours the doors were locked with the lights off - midday outside of the lunch hour).

I'm glad you found a set that works great for you - I'm in the market for new irons next spring - we'll see where I go with that.

Hello fellow Rochesterian!
I can understand your frustration.
I tried to call too - but kept getting some cental CC function.
So I ended up just booking my fitting time online.
Since then, and after my fitting, my fitter John has given me his personal cell phone if I need anything - so communication has not been a problem.

And yes, I'm absolutely loving my new clubs (based on my simulator time) - most especially the irons.
Can't wait to get them out on the course next spring!

I think the advantages to CC from my perspective are free access to the simulators and the guarantee on the clubs.
Does Pennfair have any perks? I have heard good things about them, but am extremely happy with my CC results.

 

[DataDude]

Thanks for sharing this with us @BigE. I missed this as it was happening, but really enjoyed reading through the thread. I always appreciate these types of reviews.

 

[BigE]

Thanks for sharing this with us @BigE. I missed this as it was happening, but really enjoyed reading through the thread. I always appreciate these types of reviews.

No problem. Happy to do it. I've enjoyed the experience.

 

[etakmit]

Hello fellow Rochesterian!
I can understand your frustration.
I tried to call too - but kept getting some cental CC function.
So I ended up just booking my fitting time online.
Since then, and after my fitting, my fitter John has given me his personal cell phone if I need anything - so communication has not been a problem.

And yes, I'm absolutely loving my new clubs (based on my simulator time) - most especially the irons.
Can't wait to get them out on the course next spring!

I think the advantages to CC from my perspective are free access to the simulators and the guarantee on the clubs.
Does Pennfair have any perks? I have heard good things about them, but am extremely happy with my CC results.

I've been to pennfair a handful of times for driver and other individual club work - so I can't speak to the additional stuff you encountered because i didn't utilize them that heavily. They've been great for actual club work though along with questions I've had of them. My driver fitting was good. I went in with a single brand in mind. They didn't push others on me and we found something that works for me (when I put a good swing on it).

 

[BigE]

I've been to pennfair a handful of times for driver and other individual club work - so I can't speak to the additional stuff you encountered because i didn't utilize them that heavily. They've been great for actual club work though along with questions I've had of them. My driver fitting was good. I went in with a single brand in mind. They didn't push others on me and we found something that works for me (when I put a good swing on it).

I'll have to check them out sometime. I've never been there. They're not very far from where I live.

 

[etakmit]

I'll have to check them out sometime. I've never been there. They're not very far from where I live.

Very good people - they were doing actual building for some of the manufacturers to help get clubs to their customers quicker (ie manufacturers just sending all components to them and Pennfair was doing the assembly too).

 

[jjfcpa]

I thought the same thing. I think I remember reading somewhere that because of the unique Paderson manufacturing process - the shafts don't have spines?
Not 100% sure of that though. I actually contacted the Paderson folks through there website to see if they had any comment. Still waiting for a response.
Plus, I think a lot of people just question the value of puring with ANY high quality shaft.
All of this has me thinking I'll might decline the puring option.
I'd be interested to hear any other thoughts on this.

Purring the shafts is a real thing, but honestly, in a fitting I had with CC, I had the shafts pured and then found that they didn't perform all that well. Replaced with some stock shafts and felt great. Not sure I would spend the money for that option. I've also been told that they can't pure some shafts that are too thin. That was during my last fitting with TrueSpec and they fitted me for Vylyn shaft in my driver, which I'd never heard of.

 

[BigE]

Ok, another update on my CC fitting.
As I've mentioned before on this thread - I absolutely love my new clubs: the Callaway Full Toe wedges, the Callaway DCB irons, and the Srixon ZX 4 hybrid. I've been hitting them at a simulator for well over a month now (we're into winter weather here in Upstate NY)
They have performed as advertised with a tighter dispersion and a little more distance (vs my prior clubs).
Not to mention I just love how they feel. I couldn't be happier with that portion of my fitting!
My only problem child was my Callaway Epic Speed 3W.
I was hitting it ok, but there just didn't seem to be enough of a yardage gap from my hybrid.
After hitting both clubs a lot recently to make sure the gap issue was real - the new 4 hybrid settled in at the 195-200 yd range when struck well (total, with carry) whereas my Epic 3W seemed to be in the 200-205 yd range.
Every once in a while, if I swung out of my shoes, and struck the ball perfectly - I might get that 3W up to 215.
But it seemed like I had to work too hard to do it, and it wasn't happening often enough.
I just wasn't 100% happy with that club.
So it was time to check out the CC "guaranteed fit" promise and find out what that really means.
So I went to CC today and explained my concerns and what I was experiencing.
And both fitters there were super helpful (it was the end of the day, no one was in getting fit - so they were both trying to help me)
We tried out a longer shaft, a head with a little less loft, a softer flex, and a few other options.
None of, which they said, they would charge me for if that's what fixed the problem.
(so they were basically willing to replace the shaft or the head and the labor to re-assemble - all for free)
Ultimately, the solution turned out to be much simpler in that all they had to do was take a little weight out of the head (I think they took out a couple of grams by replacing a heavier weight screw with a lighter one).
And OMG - what a change! It was only a couple of grams but I could feel the difference.
I immediately, and effortlessly, started smacking that 3 wood around 215-220 yds with the occasional 230 yd smash.
Problem solved!
And now I'm stoked about ALL my new clubs.
Bottom line: I spent an hour with the fitters at no charge to me. I was also impressed that they were willing to give me a different shaft or head if that fixed the problem; again at no charge to me.
They made good on their promise.
They certainly do stand behind their work and I'm certainly a 100% happy customer now.

 

[etakmit]

Ok, another update on my CC fitting.
As I've mentioned before on this thread - I absolutely love my new clubs: the Callaway Full Toe wedges, the Callaway DCB irons, and the Srixon ZX 4 hybrid. I've been hitting them at a simulator for well over a month now (we're into winter weather here in Upstate NY)
They have performed as advertised with a tighter dispersion and a little more distance (vs my prior clubs).
Not to mention I just love how they feel. I couldn't be happier with that portion of my fitting!
My only problem child was my Callaway Epic Speed 3W.
I was hitting it ok, but there just didn't seem to be enough of a yardage gap from my hybrid.
After hitting both clubs a lot recently to make sure the gap issue was real - the new 4 hybrid settled in at the 195-200 yd range when struck well (total, with carry) whereas my Epic 3W seemed to be in the 200-205 yd range.
Every once in a while, if I swung out of my shoes, and struck the ball perfectly - I might get that 3W up to 215.
But it seemed like I had to work too hard to do it, and it wasn't happening often enough.
I just wasn't 100% happy with that club.
So it was time to check out the CC "guaranteed fit" promise and find out what that really means.
So I went to CC today and explained my concerns and what I was experiencing.
And both fitters there were super helpful (it was the end of the day, no one was in getting fit - so they were both trying to help me)
We tried out a longer shaft, a head with a little less loft, a softer flex, and a few other options.
None of, which they said, they would charge me for if that's what fixed the problem.
(so they were basically willing to replace the shaft or the head and the labor to re-assemble - all for free)
Ultimately, the solution turned out to be much simpler in that all they had to do was take a little weight out of the head (I think they took out a couple of grams by replacing a heavier weight screw with a lighter one).
And OMG - what a change! It was only a couple of grams but I could feel the difference.
I immediately, and effortlessly, started smacking that 3 wood around 215-220 yds with the occasional 230 yd smash.
Problem solved!
And now I'm stoked about ALL my new clubs.
Bottom line: I spent an hour with the fitters at no charge to me. I was also impressed that they were willing to give me a different shaft or head if that fixed the problem; again at no charge to me.
They made good on their promise.
They certainly do stand behind their work and I'm certainly a 100% happy customer now.

Love that it was an easy fix!! Glad you got that 3w up to where it should be

 

[BigE]

Love that it was an easy fix!! Glad you got that 3w up to where it should be

Thanks. I'm happy too. I want to love ALL the clubs in my bag! lol....

And thinking about it for another day, it also makes sense to that the ultimate fix was only a small weight change in the head. That tells me the initial fitting for that club was pretty much right on. Getting it "exactly right" only took a little tweek.

 

[TeeJayeff]

I picked up the DCBs this year. I think you'll love them. I cheaped out and didn't get a fitting (I spent too much on graphite shafts) but I used the old Ping color system chart and it worked well!