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Par 5 hole designs that you love or hate?

pingman222

pingman222

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So this spawns from playing with a bunch of THPers this past weekend at coronado golf course in San Diego. I believe it was the 14th hole, a par 5, and the general consensus from the group was that it was a terribly designed hole. OB down the right side of the hole (in the middle of the course), and more OB comes into play on the approach that's just a local rule thing to speed up play and prevent people from hitting from other fwys.

In general, I pretty much dislike par 5's requiring a forced layup, or anything that doesn't at least allow someone to keep it in mind that they can go for it in 2. The best par 5's to me are risk/reward for hitting a good tee shot to setup at least a look at going at it in 2.

What are the design elements you guys look for in par 5's that make them enjoyable to you vs the ones you hate?
 
A local course used to have a par 5 that required a 210 ish yard shot before reaching a ravine. It was impossible to carry the ravine, so forced layup. From there you had a two way uneven lie over the ravine down to a fairway that was swverely sloped uphill. This meant a guaranteed long uphill 3rd shot to a near blind pin. I hated this hole.

I tend to like par 5s that are reachable in two but with 2 good shots.
 
tequila4kapp said:
A local course used to have a par 5 that required a 210 ish yard shot before reaching a ravine. It was impossible to carry the ravine, so forced layup. From there you had a two way uneven lie over the ravine down to a fairway that was swverely sloped uphill. This meant a guaranteed long uphill 3rd shot to a near blind pin. I hated this hole.
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I used to play at a club that had a long par 5, it was 600+ from the tips, however the tee shot was elevated by 100+ feet. It was alot of fun to hit the tee shot but that's about where all the fun ended. The approach if going for it in 2 was very wonky. The entire fairway sloped heavily from left to right, and severely downhill. You had to play it 2.5 clubs short, hit it way left of your target, and just hope that the slope and distance judgement would get your ball on the green. What made it even worse was that the back and right portion of the green was a dropoff into water hazard. So now you're staring down a blind, downhill, 2.5 club short shot that you have to hit 35 yards left and just hope that when you walk up there that your ball is somewhere you can find it.
 
#16 at Black Mesa in Espanola NM (north of Santa Fe) is a good example of a par 5 I love. It's a tough hole and when I play it I know I am in for a challenge. 536 from the tips - you have a 180 carry across an arroyo to a landing area and then it is uphill, a lot. Fairway is decent sized but miss it is deadly - desert and drop-offs. Never reached it in 2 (got to the front fringe a couple of times) but almost eagled it with a chip in. Great hole. Drone video link below.

 
For me I like a variety of par 5s but in my opinion it's most critical that on a course with 4 par 5s that they work together and offer some different looks.

Just reachable but water to carry? Love it!
Straight ahead and loooong? Fine, but no more than one please.
Short with no trouble? Boring, but one of these won't hurt.
 
pingman222 said:
In general, I pretty much dislike par 5's requiring a forced layup, or anything that doesn't at least allow someone to keep it in mind that they can go for it in 2. The best par 5's to me are risk/reward for hitting a good tee shot to setup at least a look at going at it in 2.
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I could have written this myself. I absolutely hate par 5s that make you layup. Give me a chance to go for it, even if I can find some trouble. Risk/reward!
 
Can's speak to any that I just love, but there is one I definitely hate. I have to tee off with a 7 iron to lay up to a lake, and then hit something like 4 iron and 5 iron up a hill to reach the green. That design just bothers me.

~Rock
 
I don't like a long par five that has a lot of trouble around the green. I'm a big believer that the shorter the hole the more trouble you have on arrival and the longer the hole the less trouble near the green.
 
I dislike the long/straight par 5, the ones you bang balls on twice and hope to get to the green; boring! A good par 5 should have both risk and reward, be it OB, water, dogleg, blind shot, whatever...
 
It all starts with the driving area, if it's large, I like, if not, I don't, I'm not one to go for a lot of greens in 2, so the length doesn't make a whole lot of difference to me!
 
I really dislike double dogleg par 5's, as well as the par 5 where you have to lay up off the tee because of a hazard. That bothers me.

I like par 5's with a forced carry though for the second shot if you want to get there in two. They're not always fun, but they always put a lump in your throat after contact as you start to wonder if you got all of that one or was that the right club.
 
I don't like any par 4 or par 5 that force you to play the hole a certain way. I like having multiple options as it makes the game more fun.
 
MWard said:
I really dislike double dogleg par 5's, as well as the par 5 where you have to lay up off the tee because of a hazard. That bothers me.

I like par 5's with a forced carry though for the second shot if you want to get there in two. They're not always fun, but they always put a lump in your throat after contact as you start to wonder if you got all of that one or was that the right club.
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This is what I really don't like. Because you're requiring basically two perfect shots to have any chance to get on in regulation, because the dogleg puts a requirement on both direction and distance. There have been a couple courses I've played where I was hitting a longer club on my second shot than my first because of a crazy dogleg or something. I guess the exception to me would be at a course that makes it clear that you're playing target golf going in - a couple courses that wind through mountains or cranberry bogs around here come to mind.

Like you, I don't necessarily have a problem with a longer par 5 with a forced layup in front of the green or something to make it a true 3 shot hole (for most people), especially if the hazards are natural and the course designer worked around them. Plus, that feeling you get if you hit it in 2? Intoxicating.
 
I kind of like double dogleg par 5's as long as they are not super long. #2 at Rebsamen in Little Rock is a great hole. It's 511/Blue or 549 from the tips. It's a dl left either over, or around a stand of tall trees. From the champion tees it's over, from the blues it makes more sense to draw it around the trees. It leaves you 240 out with a tall tree 60 in front of the green and traps between the tree and green. You have to hit a power fade 3 wood to get on in two. Takes two perfect shots - done it once (from the blues), usually I'm chipping from 30 yards out.
 
McRock said:
Can's speak to any that I just love, but there is one I definitely hate. I have to tee off with a 7 iron to lay up to a lake, and then hit something like 4 iron and 5 iron up a hill to reach the green. That design just bothers me.

~Rock
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I have a par 5 just like that at my home course. You have to hit a 200 yard shot off the tee to the front of a big ditch. The other side of the ditch has a narrow opening because of trees, where the course then bends a bit to the left. So I basically always hit 6I, 6I, then wedge. The green is uphill and surrounded by traps, so it is almost impossible to go for it in 2.
 
I like Par 5s that let me go after it in 2 with a great tee shot, but still let me salvage a birdie/par if my tee shot was less than desirable.
 
I hate forced lay ups with irons
 
I hate forced layups off the tee. If you want to make it narrow or strategically place hazards, so that hitting a driver is a real risk/reward play, fine. If you want to make the hole so long that it can't be reached in two, okay. If you want to make the second shot a huge risk/reward, that seems reasonable. But, in my opinion, any design that completely eliminates the possibility of driver on a par 5 is a terrible design.
 
There aren't any that I dislike. I just don't like multiple par 5's on a course that require me to layup to the same number. I want different risk/reward from each par 5.
 
bigskyirish said:
I hate forced layups off the tee. If you want to make it narrow or strategically place hazards, so that hitting a driver is a real risk/reward play, fine. If you want to make the hole so long that it can't be reached in two, okay. If you want to make the second shot a huge risk/reward, that seems reasonable. But, in my opinion, any design that completely eliminates the possibility of driver on a par 5 is a terrible design.
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This is pretty much it. There's ways to make 4- par 5's on a golf course all play completely different, but at the same time still be "proper" in the sense that you get options.

One of my better player friends once said, you want to make a good player struggle? You give them options on a course.

I luckily dont run into many par 5s around here that require a longer second shot than the first, but it would really bother me If I had to do that.

And yes, the feeling you get when puring a drive, and then puring a 2nd shot onto a green is very very addicting, no matter if it results in more bigger numbers than the eagles it produces!
 
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Par 5's that require you to lay up off the tee always bug me. Two courses I've played recently had par 5's that required me to hit irons off the tee due to 100+yds of hazards placed in the middle of the fairways.

Risk/reward par 5's I love. The ones that if you smash a drive, you have the opportunity to get it home in 2 with a well struck 2nd. But if you don't catch the tee shot clean, the hazards around the green make you think twice about pulling out a fairway wood. Hole 8 at Aviara is a great example of this. 540ish yd dogleg left par 5 with a lake in front of the green so you can't roll a ball there... all carry. Loved that hole!
 
I should have added a poll but it looks like the general consensus is that most people here are hating on forced layup off the tee Par 5's, which makes sense to me as to why its not something people enjoy playing. I would also agree with the camp that says that it doesn't always have to be a design that is gettable in 2, but it should be "inviting" to tempt you to. I can't even begin to count the times when i've pulled out the fwy wood from big yardages knowing theres probably 0 chance i'll get there, but hey why not just try to get close only to find trouble when a 150 yard layup would have been fine. OPTIONS!!
 
A long dog leg left where you have to turn the ball over from right to left based on the fairway running out to the right.

Then there is that one Par 5 design on a certain course in Ohio we all love. Zigzag city.
 
I hate dog leg par 5's that I can't see the dog leg. We played the Cliffs this past weekend and had 3 par 5's that were dog legs but with the layout, it looked, from the tee box, that you had plenty of room when in fact the fairway you were looking at was a completely different hole. I just ask to see what I'm looking at.
 
Double dog leg par 5's and also those that don't give you the option of hitting driver off the tee. There's one par 5 near me that fits both of these. It requires a draw shaped tee shot of no more than 230 yards. That leaves you 340 yards remaining that really requires either you to hug the right tree line or a cut off of a draw sloped lie to get your second shot in the fairway. I'm a pretty decent shotmaker and have only been able to make par on this hole maybe once out of every 5 times I play it.
 
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