Agree to disagree...
The Official 2015 NFL Thread
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How is this not right up there with what Sean Payton went through with his year long suspension? If I remember correctly he was found guilty by the NFL, while they proved he had no 1st hand knowledge of the BountyGate, that being the head coach he should have known or it happened under his watch sort of thing. Add in the fact that this would be the 3rd time he and the Patroits were found to have cheated to get an advantage.
Bounty Gate was a big deal and the head coach went down for it without any proof he knew it was going on. I don't think the fact that BB "appears" to have not known about the balls is going to give him an out. This is going to be fascinating to watch now what the NFL decides to do here. The standard was set with the Saints and now we get to see if they follow up the zero tolerance rule or is the good old boy system still in play with Mr. Kraft and Co.
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- #1,428
Evidence is why its different. Same with the "crime".
And FWIW, I have not said anything about Bill B directly or Payton.
Do you think the Colts should be punished?
I find the entire thing kind of crazy.
I'm with ya on the crazy part. It's stupid. It's dumb. It's really a waste of time for everyone. But they chose to dig and the findings point to cheating and breaking the rules set by the NFL. Once again, the attention is back on the NFL and Roger to make a decision. I really think they are going to be forced to do something here based on the Saints outcome. While different, there are some common denominators with both situations. I don't think taking away draft picks this time is going to cut it.
Sanzabar
Oh So Colt!
I wonder when the punishment will be handed down. I would imagine the NFL is going to go a bit hard just due to public opinion.
Its not a court, so they may not have to prove with certainty someone did anything. Maybe they can fine and suspend someone for just plain not liking their face. I don't know, so I'll offer up my opinion in the meantime. The Hernandez case is different because a jury found that the prosecution removed all reasonable doubt that the crime was committed by someone other than Aaron Hernandez. That's what's needed in that situation, and that standard was met.
If they had solid proof that he said, "Hey, take a pound out of the game balls on the sly, ya dig?", in any form or fashion, I'd be all for some punishment. I guess I'm just big on being proven guilty on something to be punished for it, rather than assumed more probably than not guilty of something. But like I said, its not a court, and I have no say in who gets punished or not, for maybe doing something... or not.
So you're saying that the reports does say with certainty that those guys deflated the balls and Brady knew about it? It is more probable than not that we'll still disagree about the ambiguity of the language used in the future. See what I did there?
Sanzabar
Oh So Colt!
Browns GM suspended 4 games and fined $250,000 for texting outside of the allowable window.
Falcons GM/Team fined $350,000 and docked a 2016 draft pick for artificial crowd noise. GM, Coach and Owner were found to know nothing about it.
I can bet the punishment will be fairly steep.
Falcons GM/Team fined $350,000 and docked a 2016 draft pick for artificial crowd noise. GM, Coach and Owner were found to know nothing about it.
I can bet the punishment will be fairly steep.
Was it proven they did those things, or proven more probable than not they did those things?
Mulligan9111
Go Skers!!
I absolutely hate the Patriots and even I think that if there are suspensions handed out for this it will be the laughing stock of professional sports. Absolutely zero evidence that the Patriots intentionally deflated the balls. All they have is text messages from a locker room attendant and an equipment guy talking about how one is mad at Tom so he's going to inflate the balls to where he doesn't like it and that he wants free stuff from Tom, never once do they mention dropping the PSI below league rules.
Sanzabar
Oh So Colt!
They turned over the evidence, therefore, they were found guilty.
Brady will not turn over the evidence. Hard to compare.
Looks to me that they tried to be the whistleblowers:
"According to the report, the league first became aware of the possibility that the Patriots were deflating the footballs when Ryan Grigson, the general manager of the Colts, sent an email to two senior members of the NFL Football Operations Department days before the AFC championship game.
In the email, Grigson included a note from a Colts equipment manager that said the Patriots were known for deflating footballs. He added: "All the Indianapolis Colts want is a completely level playing field. Thank you for being vigilant stewards of that not only for us but for the shield and overall integrity of our game."
Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/new-...balls-indianapolis-colts-2015-5#ixzz3ZStmgHTd
Sanzabar
Oh So Colt!
You do not think Brady saying to McNally about Jastremski, "you must have a lot of stress trying to get them done…” in regards to the footballs is pointing to being in the know? Or what about Brady texting asking McNally if he was okay after all of the Deflategate stuff came out?
Lets not forget Brady said he didnt even really know McNally or what he did in the organization... wait, yet, he text him quite a bit after deflategate?
Sanzabar
Oh So Colt!
If I am not mistaken, the Colts were tipped off by the Ravens and Jets as well. Also, McNally was questioned back in 2004 about an incident.
The weird thing to me is that A TON of players are no shocked and that they knew the Patriots were doing this.
Sanzabar
Oh So Colt!
This part makes me chuckle...
Jastremski and McNally texted quite a bit about needles, and McNally seemed to be angrier at Brady than Rex Ryan has ever been. Except, of course, when the locker room attendant was apparently looking for autographed footballs, sneakers and cash for his services. On Jan. 10, 2015, in a meeting witnessed by Jastremski in the Patriots' equipment room before the playoff victory over the Baltimore Ravens, the report states McNally "received two footballs autographed by Brady and also had Brady autograph a game-worn Patriots jersey that McNally previously had obtained."
But when questioned, Brady claimed he didn't know Jim McNally from Jim McMahon. Maybe the quarterback's texts and emails would've told a different story about that.
Jastremski and McNally texted quite a bit about needles, and McNally seemed to be angrier at Brady than Rex Ryan has ever been. Except, of course, when the locker room attendant was apparently looking for autographed footballs, sneakers and cash for his services. On Jan. 10, 2015, in a meeting witnessed by Jastremski in the Patriots' equipment room before the playoff victory over the Baltimore Ravens, the report states McNally "received two footballs autographed by Brady and also had Brady autograph a game-worn Patriots jersey that McNally previously had obtained."
But when questioned, Brady claimed he didn't know Jim McNally from Jim McMahon. Maybe the quarterback's texts and emails would've told a different story about that.
Mulligan9111
Go Skers!!
Brady very well could have known, but everything that's been shown to the public points to a lot of guessing and inference by the investigators. I would expect that if there was blatant cheating going on, they would have been able to find something in the 4 months they took to investigate.
Those text messages don't really mean anything to me. Him asking if an employee of the organization he works for is okay after an event like this, could simply be a way of showing that employee support.
Sanzabar
Oh So Colt!
But yet when this all came out, he said he didnt know Jim McNally from Jim McMahon!? He said he didnt really know who he was or what he did. Yet he gave him signed footballs, jerseys, etc...?
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- #1,444
Check again : )
Mulligan9111
Go Skers!!
And Michael Jordan gave away signed game shoes to ball-boys after games as well, do you think Michael personally knew them? Highly doubtful.
Sanzabar
Oh So Colt!
Do you think MJ texted and called them and spoke with them for 25 minutes?
Sanzabar
Oh So Colt!
Where did it say that? This is what I saw on ESPN (I have not read the entire report)
• "All 11 of the Patriots game balls tested measured below the minimum pressure level of 12.5 pounds per square inch ("psi") allowed by Rule 2... The four Colts balls tested each measured within the 12.5 to 13.5 psi range." Scientific studies were conducted that determined a 0.4 percent chance "that the difference in average drops between the teams occurred by chance."
Sanzabar
Oh So Colt!
Just read the part where they tested the balls for both teams.
All 11 of the balls that the Patriots had were tested by 2 gauges and none of them were at least 12.5 psi from both gauges. 4 of the Colts footballs were tested and all 4 within the 12.5 to 13.5 psi on at least one gauge.
Sanzabar
Oh So Colt!
Vegas already took the game off of the board.
Don't forget the Steelers are without Leveon Bell as well.
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