The future of Irons and their lofts

[ArmyGolf]

I believe that as the OEM's develop more and more tech and obtain new ways to move the weight around to create higher, lower spinning ball flights the lofts will continue to drop accordingly.
What I am curious to see is what is going to happen at the bottom end of the bag over the next 5 - 10 years. Eventually, assuming they continue making technological progress, we are going to have 40* PW's that launch the same as an old 50* PW but go 30 yards further due to the lower spin, higher ball speeds etc. Will the 60* Wedge become obsolete and 56 be the new loft wedge? Do wedge technologies advance at an even pace and fly further as well?
Also, I think we are kidding ourselves a little bit if we think that OEM 'A' doesn't care if their 7-iron goes further than OEM 'B's 7-iron, so although that isn't the main reason it's still an influencing force behind the advancements we are seeing.

If the governing bodies decide to reel in the OEM's a bit and limit how far golfers can hit the ball I think they'll do it with new rules and regs on the golf ball itself, not on the clubs per say, but I'm purely speculating here.

 

[P.J.]

So a PW that is 48*? What about those that played a PW that was 50*? Which is "right"?
To show that is completely based on ball flight, take a look at a company' sets and the ones that launch the ball higher have stronger lofts and the ones that are more game enhancement are similar to what you are after. Choices. Its good for everybody.

Like I said, I'm not looking at right and wrong. If someday my needs change and I do need an iron design that helps me get the ball in the air, then I'll be changing quick fast and in a hurry regardless of loft. My OP was more asking what do you see in 10, 20, 30 years. With the SGI tech improving and helping a larger portion of the public, yet at the same time driving a change in loft; what will irons be? Will the SGI lines stop manufacturing 3 irons as they have 1 irons and in most cases 2 irons (Fyi, not trying to bring hybrids in to the discussion). For example, with a few exceptions, irons are the only clubs that aren't defined by their loft. Will that change due to the technology advancements at its side effects

Just trying to add some deep conversation here. Thanks for helping drive it JB

 

[teed-off]

If you want the club to go 150 yards and it does, who cares what is stamped on the sole.

I've never been one to have the most distance in my irons. I want accuracy/pin seeking ability. Sure it'd be nice to have a 230 5 iron but when it comes down to it: you can have all the distance you want but a solid swing and good accuracy gives you nothing for distance

I agree with these two statements and IMHO, accuracy trumps distance every time but, I do not speak for all golfers, nor do I wish to start another "accuracy vs distance " argument which has been discussed in other posts.

There are definitely golfers who want the most distance out of their clubs and would do what it takes to hit a 5 iron 250 yards. This is what drives the golf market and it is good that there are different clubs, shafts, balls and mods that can make to your clubs to help get your game to where you want it.

The future of irons and their lofts looks good to me.

 

[P.J.]

I believe that as the OEM's develop more and more tech and obtain new ways to move the weight around to create higher, lower spinning ball flights the lofts will continue to drop accordingly.
What I am curious to see is what is going to happen at thebottom end of the bag over the next 5 - 10 years. Eventually, assuming they continue making technological progress, we are going to have 40* PW's that launch the same as an old 50* PW but go 30 yards further due to the lower spin, higher ball speeds etc. Will the 60* Wedge become obsolete and 56 be the new loft wedge? Do wedge technologies advance at an even pace and fly further as well?
Also, I think we are kidding ourselves a little bit if we think that OEM 'A' doesn't care if their 7-iron goes further than OEM 'B's 7-iron, so although that isn't the main reason it's still an influencing force behind the advancements we are seeing.

If the governing bodies decide to reel in the OEM's a bit and limit how far golfers can hit the ball I think they'll do it with new rules and regs on the golf ball itself, not on the clubs per say, but I'm purely speculating here.

Yes! ArmyGolf is headed in the direction I was headed. Where are we headed and how will it effect the industry

 

[P.J.]

I suspect the premise may be flawed. I suspect they would design an iron and measure its launch angle then determine the number to stamp on it. It wouldn't be a ballooning 7i it would be a properly functioning 9 (or whatever) iron.

I see. I won't pretend to know the OEM design stages. More or less asking why match the loft with the number designation they picked versus another number or loft

 

[blugold]

It my experience that iron loft has little to no impact on iron distance.

 

[JB]

It my experience that iron loft has little to no impact on iron distance.

Really? How is this possible?
You hit you 8 iron further than your 9 iron right?

 

[Smallville]

It my experience that iron loft has little to no impact on iron distance.

I know what you're saying, and agree to a point, but try to hit a 60° 3 iron 200 yards!

 

[blugold]

The future of Irons and their lofts

Really? How is this possible?
You hit you 8 iron further than your 9 iron right?

I should have clarified. A 6i in a GI (JPX825, Speedbladez) goes as far as a 6i in a players (MP69, 714 CB). For me at least.

Yes loft matters. But a 6i is a 6i.

 

[ArmyGolf]

I guess you could take 8 34* heads and and put different length shafts and different lie angles in them and play a set like that...but I'll take different lofts any day.

 

[TRyan]

I should have clarified. A 6i in a GI (JPX825, Speedbladez) goes as far as a 6i in a players (MP69, 714 CB).

Yes loft matters. But a 6i is a 6i.

Really? I havent seen that at all, but maybe I am in the minority.

 

[JB]

I should have clarified. A 6i in a GI (JPX825, Speedbladez) goes as far as a 6i in a players (MP69, 714 CB). For me at least.

Yes loft matters. But a 6i is a 6i.

Whoa. Really? I can honestly say that is the first time I have ever heard of this and never seen it before in person. In fact I will go a step further and say I think you should check the distances on the monitor you were using to gather those yardages because I dont think they were accurate or that you might have mis-hit a few of them.

 

[P.J.]

Really? I havent seen that at all, but maybe I am in the minority.

Aside from the fact that there are a gazillion variables in play, if you could perfect the setup of either style to your swing I'd believe the GI would have the edge. I think that's the goal of the OEMs

 

[blugold]

Whoa. Really? I can honestly say that is the first time I have ever heard of this and never seen it before in person. In fact I will go a step further and say I think you should check the distances on the monitor you were using to gather those yardages because I dont think they were accurate or that you might have mis-hit a few of them.

I will do that next time I have some time. It might have a lot (mostly all) to do with the availability of shaft choices in players iron demo carts. The GI options don't seem to fit me quite right.

 

[Tadashi70]

I agree, but not the point I was trying to make. More trying to gauge the future of the industry and what people see happening

I think there will be a wall that lofts will stay neutral or the new normal what ever that ends up being. But I honestly think the debate or question should be about shafts. I can change my distance, trajectory and launch by switching shafts. Companies are building shafts that really contribute more to the clubs performance then the lofts.

 

[blugold]

I think there will be a wall that lofts will stay neutral or the new normal what ever that ends up being. But I honestly think the debate or question should be about shafts. I can change my distance, trajectory and launch by switching shafts. Companies are building shafts that really contribute more to the clubs performance then the lofts.

Freddie is smarter than me. I agree 100% on the shafts.

 

[P.J.]

I think there will be a wall that lofts will stay neutral or the new normal what ever that ends up being. But I honestly think the debate or question should be about shafts. I can change my distance, trajectory and launch by switching shafts. Companies are building shafts that really contribute more to the clubs performance then the lofts.

Thanks for the input. I only know the basics on shafts but I can believe they will have a growing impact going forward.

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[Jman]

I should have clarified. A 6i in a GI (JPX825, Speedbladez) goes as far as a 6i in a players (MP69, 714 CB). For me at least.

Yes loft matters. But a 6i is a 6i.

Thats interesting, I played with 4 different 8i's in my bag for testing today (s55, i20, Yonex XP, and Altitude) and the XP and Altitudes at the same length were a club and a half longer, different designs Players/GI/SGI/whatever have different perimeter weighting and builds for a reason, those things have a direct correlation on the MOI and the CG of a club and thusly the launch and distances we are going to see.

 

[blugold]

Thats interesting, I played with 4 different 8i's in my bag for testing today (s55, i20, Yonex XP, and Altitude) and the XP and Altitudes at the same length were a club and a half longer, different designs Players/GI/SGI/whatever have different perimeter weighting and builds for a reason, those things have a direct correlation on the MOI and the CG of a club and thusly the launch and distances we are going to see.

Not disputing that. I don't have a problem hitting down with my irons. Maybe I am ballooning those GI clubs. I don't flush every shot every swing. But I would imagine that for me, the shaft makes more of a difference than the loft.

 

[P.J.]

Thats interesting, I played with 4 different 8i's in my bag for testing today (s55, i20, Yonex XP, and Altitude) and the XP and Altitudes at the same length were a club and a half longer, different designs Players/GI/SGI/whatever have different perimeter weighting and builds for a reason, those things have a direct correlation on the MOI and the CG of a club and thusly the launch and distances we are going to see.

Good points Jman. As new clubs are made attempting to promote higher launch, more forgiveness, longer carry, etc do you see the lofts having to strengthen to avoid negative effects? And do you see the shift tapering off?

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[Brianbigoats]

Going from a Rbladez 8i (35*) to Rbladez Tour 8i (38*) i lost about 5 yards after the switch but gained better trajectory and lower spin. for me the smaller iron helped my ball striking be more cosistant ( clubs were the same length)


I think that we have seen about the max of loft strenghing If sets start coming with a Gap wedge and a Gap-2 Wedge there might be some push back and more people buying none set wedges which is bad for some OEM's

 

[Brianbigoats]

Not disputing that. I don't have a problem hitting down with my irons. Maybe I am ballooning those GI clubs. I don't flush every shot every swing. But I would imagine that for me, the shaft makes more of a difference than the loft.

Ballooning GI Irons is a problem that i have had before

 

[JB]

Not disputing that. I don't have a problem hitting down with my irons. Maybe I am ballooning those GI clubs. I don't flush every shot every swing. But I would imagine that for me, the shaft makes more of a difference than the loft.

I would be very interested to see this on a monitor. I would be pretty surprised to see normal shafts you would be testing (not fine tuned from fitting) playing more of a role in distance than that of loft.

In a small case ballooning exists, but you were speaking of multiple sets.

 

[Jman]

Good points Jman. As new clubs are made attempting to promote higher launch, more forgiveness, longer carry, etc do you see the lofts having to strengthen to avoid negative effects? And do you see the shift tapering off?

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Since the loft is predicated on what type of launch the companies can get out of their irons depending on the technological advancements that they make I'm really not sure. One would imagine there has to be a wall in there somewhere, but I look at it from the side that if I can hit a 44* PW longer AND higher than I can a 48* PW at the same lengths then it changes the way that golfers can play the game and how they attack the course. Taking a "modern lofted" 8i into a green from 165 instead of a "Traditionally lofted" 6i from the same distance is night and day for amateurs IMO form a confidence standpoint alone. Same loft, shorter club, AND holds the green better? Game changer IMO.

But as for where it will stop, I guess that depends on the technology that comes along down the line, how much further companies can push undercut cavities and such, ya know? I do know it'll be a fun ride finding out, because I do love me some shiny stuff! hahaha

 

[Jman]

Going from a Rbladez 8i (35*) to Rbladez Tour 8i (38*) i lost about 5 yards after the switch but gained better trajectory and lower spin. for me the smaller iron helped my ball striking be more cosistant ( clubs were the same length)


I think that we have seen about the max of loft strenghing If sets start coming with a Gap wedge and a Gap-2 Wedge there might be some push back and more people buying none set wedges which is bad for some OEM's

BUT, if they can get stronger lofts and INCREASE the launch thusly making the club easier for most golfers to hit then what is the harm with adding another set wedge? Get me to the green faster and make it more fun, thats all that matter to me, not loft.

I honestly believe all of the "jacked up loft" arguments we hear is based on ego alone, people have to find something to complain about rather than just TRYING it and looking at the SCIENCE behind why the lofts have changed d over the years (LAUNCH LAUNCH LAUNCH!).