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Driver Loft Thought Process Changes

Splendorlex

Splendorlex

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I've noticed hints here and there that folks have been thinking a little differently about loft when it comes to the driver. Is this a relatively new development, or have I just been out of the loop? In my experience, the "better" golfers I knew just tended to get lower and lower with the lofts on their driver. 9.5 > 9 > 8.5 and so on. Now I'm seeing some people talk about lofts of 12 or so on Drivers.

What's the thinking behind this? Or am I just making something up that isn't really there?
 
I think its gaining traction, I will say though there are still a TON that are resistant to it, could it be ego? Maybe.

We are seeing more and more the ability for golfers to get to go and SEE their numbers and what more loft can do for them (good and bad). Traditionally most golfers believe they hit it "too high" when in reality its anything but. Of course, where you play matters too, if you play on hardpan fairways most of the year a 7.5 driver could roll 350, those people generally won't see the point in lofting up. I was once that way, then I traveled out of state to play and realized carry never lies.
 
I've been playing 10.5* on my driver for at least 10 years. My new driver is a 9* head set at 10* and I'll probably go to 11* or flip the gravity core up. I really miss the flight of my RFX with the black tie in it.
 
Jman said:
I think its gaining traction, I will say though there are still a TON that are resistant to it, could it be ego? Maybe.
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See this firsthand ALL the time on the course. Played a round with my uncle and two of his regular partners down in CA a few weeks back, and the one guy was playing a 9 or 9.5 driver and not getting the ball more than about 15 or 20 ft off the ground all day. And then proceeded to say "That's not gonna go very far going that high" after several of my drives, despite my outdriving him by 50 yards or so hahaha. Oh and then he proceeded to recommend that I switch to a 9 or 9.5* head to see more distance with my "high swing speed". Which is under 100 mph, usually. :banghead:

I play my driver at around 11*, and I can't see playing any driver below 10.5* now, unless playing on a super firm course where I need to roll it 60 yards on the ground. Just can't consistently launch it well below that.
 
it's really the lower spin drivers that have come out recently that are allowing folks to increase loft without sacrificing distance. In many cases, it's actually resulting in more distance because it gets closer to the optimal launch angle for their swing speed.

scientific studies have been done on this topic by people much more knowledgeable than myself. Those studies can be found out there on the interwebs pretty easily, but the gist is that the sweet spot of launch angle and backspin for maximum distance varies based on swing speed. There is a point of diminishing returns for low spin/high launch, but in most cases, the average golfer is seeing more carry and more total distance by adding more loft.
 
When I first started playing, I was told "9.5-10.5*, that is what you should play." I am a low ball hitter, so I need the extra loft and usually plan on starting at 11-11.5* now that I know a little better. My brother hits the ball sky high, so he needs a 9.5*or lower otherwise he will balloon the hell out it so this isn't a universal thing.

I definitely think it is an ego thing, or in some cases just not knowing what difference loft can have and thinking the old school "lower loft = longer distance." is a universal rule.
 
mancest said:
When I first started playing, I was told "9.5-10.5*, that is what you should play." I am a low ball hitter, so I need the extra loft and usually plan on starting at 11-11.5* now that I know a little better. My brother hits the ball sky high, so he needs a 9.5*or lower otherwise he will balloon the hell out it so this isn't a universal thing.

I definitely think it is an ego thing, or in some cases just not knowing what difference loft can have and thinking the old school "lower loft = longer distance." is a universal rule.
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My understanding is that the push for higher loft drivers is really being pushed by TaylorMade, and is NOT an across the board push. Rather, it's a push FOR THEIR SPECIFIC DESIGN -- they have, by moving the CG of the driver, been able to get high swing speeds to launch with favorable spin rates even with higher lofts.

Ego shouldn't play a role in choosing a club (though I recognize that it does). GET FITTED PEOPLE... the physics don't lie, and play whatever clubs/shafts/etc get you the most favorable and consistent launch conditions. My 2c :)
 
I currently play my current driver at 10.5°. But I am experimenting more with my lofts on the driving range to start to see what differences I can get.
 
mcukier said:
My understanding is that the push for higher loft drivers is really being pushed by TaylorMade, and is NOT an across the board push. Rather, it's a push FOR THEIR SPECIFIC DESIGN -- they have, by moving the CG of the driver, been able to get high swing speeds to launch with favorable spin rates even with higher lofts.

Ego shouldn't play a role in choosing a club (though I recognize that it does). GET FITTED PEOPLE... the physics don't lie, and play whatever clubs/shafts/etc get you the most favorable and consistent launch conditions. My 2c :)
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Currently yes Taylormade is pushing the loft up campaign, but I still think the average weekend warrior is more likely to be playing a 9.5* head when they would be getting better results with an 11* then the other way around (playing too much loft).

The old adage has been that you will hit it farther with lower loft was explained to me over and over by one of the guys I was playing with Saturday. "When I hit this 8.5* right I kill it!" is what he said several times, and then he asked to hit my 11.5* and hit it 10x better (several times on the back 9 I might add).

I think most guys that have gone into fittings have found out they were fit into something with more loft then they would guess if just buying off the rack (which I don't advocate!, totally agree to go get fit!!!).
 
SkiBumGolfer said:
See this firsthand ALL the time on the course. Played a round with my uncle and two of his regular partners down in CA a few weeks back, and the one guy was playing a 9 or 9.5 driver and not getting the ball more than about 15 or 20 ft off the ground all day. And then proceeded to say "That's not gonna go very far going that high" after several of my drives, despite my outdriving him by 50 yards or so hahaha. Oh and then he proceeded to recommend that I switch to a 9 or 9.5* head to see more distance with my "high swing speed". Which is under 100 mph, usually. :banghead:

I play my driver at around 11*, and I can't see playing any driver below 10.5* now, unless playing on a super firm course where I need to roll it 60 yards on the ground. Just can't consistently launch it well below that.
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I have seen a similar thing my brothers buddy switched from a 8.5 to a 10.5 only because his wife bought if for him he has now add 30-40 yard on his drives
 
You can't just loft up any old driver. It's the drivers where the CG is up near the face to produce lower spin that you need to loft up. You don't want to be lofting up a driver where the CG is low and back.
 
Modern drivers in general are spinning less and you'll find that (compared to the past) higher lofts are providing better launch conditions for many people, regardless of front/low or back/low. Also, education and fitting is helping people realize what a good trajectory really is and how it can help them with distance.
 
Thanks everyone, I love a good discussion like this. I am starting some lessons (my first one is tomorrow!) and as part of that I expect I'll get fitted at some point too. I do certainly believe that it's the best way to see what works for YOU. I just wondered how much traction this higher loft idea was getting.
 
Guys the main factor is effective loft not static loft. Taylor Made has changed the effective loft of the club by moving the CG more forward on some offerings this year. We as golfers get different things out of drivers because of the way we swing the club. While I truthfully think loft up is not necessarily a bad thing some golfers may need to loft down as well. All factors need to be taken into consideration when being fit for a driver.
 
Driver Loft Thought Process Changes

Higher loft, low spin head, throw a shaft in there and you will benefit from a fitting service.

I've cranked my 9.5° 913 way up there, and now I'm seeing a very high trajectory, but virtually no roll. I used to hit low and huge roll...everything depends on your swing.
 
I've moved from 10.5 to 12.5 but maybe 11.5 is best. But more loft is better for me for sure...
 
this is the best article I know of on the subject:

http://www.tutelman.com/golf/ballflight/launchOptimize.php

It's a few years old, so one must take into account the fact that newer driver offerings designed to limit backspin will behave slightly differently from the ones used at the time, but the concepts still hold true. IMO, the best part of this very informative article is the 3-D graph showing the sweet spots for distance based on launch angle and backspin. That graph is for a given ball speed of 124 MPH, and the scale will slide based on ball speed (swing speed and smash factor). It shows pretty intuitively where spin rates and launch angle should be for the best results.

The most important takeaway from the article isn't in one of the graphs, though. It's that in order to fine-tune your driver for the best possible distance with your swing, you need to measure all of the variables. You need to know your average launch angle, swing speed, and how well you hit the sweet spot of the face. The answer might be more loft. It might be less. it might be more spin or less spin. It might be a softer or firmer flex in the shaft. Everyone is different. A good fitter can do all this work for you.
 
Mark_UK said:
You can't just loft up any old driver. It's the drivers where the CG is up near the face to produce lower spin that you need to loft up. You don't want to be lofting up a driver where the CG is low and back.
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ou can loft up with older drivers not just the new low forwad CG if your swing dictates those changes my dad hits his supertri in 11.5 very well better than the 8.5 head he had before it spins more but launches higher and he gained 15-20 yards
 
I currently have a 9.5 driver and want to get fitted to see if I should go up. My typical ball flight is high and I get zero to very little roll our ever. I want to get a few things worked out in the swing before I go and get fitted.
 
When I first got my R1 and got fitted the numbers were better on the monitor at 9.5....this was coming from an R9 set to 10.5NU. I also went from regular to stiff shaft. I had less side spin and picked up 9 yds of carry. That looked great on paper but real world wasn't as great as you'd think. Even though my dispersion on the monitor tighter at 9.5, I struggled on the course to get the same consistency. I think I was trying to bore them out to much and I hit a lot of low fades which ended up not running out with most of the courses up in PA/DE that I play being soft most of the year. I played most of last year with 9.5 and changed to 10.5 towards the end if the year and finished much better and more consistent. While I still do not get much roll out up here, I noticed my control and consistency is better and I'm hitting more fairways as a result. I'd gladly give up the 9 yds of carry to be in the fairway but surprisingly I am hitting it longer at 10.5. On a recent trio to florida I out drove a few fairways and hit the longest drives I've ever hit topping one out at about 290 (probably 275 carry). I toyed with he idea of trying the sldr to see where i would end up but I am finally getting comfortable with the r1 so I think I will wait til I hit my max potential with it.

Short answer is I think lofting up is a good approach for me
Personally as the courses I play most often get little to not roll out. It's better to get it there in the air if you can.


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Brianbigoats said:
ou can loft up with older drivers not just the new low forwad CG if your swing dictates those changes my dad hits his supertri in 11.5 very well better than the 8.5 head he had before it spins more but launches higher and he gained 15-20 yards
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Most amateurs play a loft too low, going for the macho 8.5 or 9.0 degree loft when a 10.5 degree would suit them far better. That's a little different to Taylor Made's loft up campaign though. If your playing a 10.5 degree R (insert number here) or burner etc etc, then increasing the loft isn't necessarily gonna be beneficial.
 
Mark_UK said:
Most amateurs play a loft too low, going for the macho 8.5 or 9.0 degree loft when a 10.5 degree would suit them far better. That's a little different to Taylor Made's loft up campaign though. If your playing a 10.5 degree R (insert number here) or burner etc etc, then increasing the loft isn't necessarily gonna be beneficial.
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Not always true increasing the loft can gain added forgiveness and give you a higher launch angle which is very beneficial to most low swing speed players
 
Brianbigoats said:
Not always true increasing the loft can gain added forgiveness and give you a higher launch angle which is very beneficial to most low swing speed players
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Don't think you read my post properly mate ;)
 
I think going up in loft is good to a point. More loft is easier to hit straight in my experience. The problem I see with too much lofting up is that ball speed seems to go down with higher lofts. In other words , there is a point of diminished returns.
 
As I'm improving on the swing, I so want to loft up. I don't have visions of my flight being high, it's really high when I do crank up the lofts. I see a lot of benefit from being able to go there, I just can't at the moment.
 
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