'17 TaylorMade M1 Driver vs Callaway Epic - #BagBattles - Jman

[Jman]

You guys have stepped up the review with the use of the launch monitor. Nothing beats data. Haven't read past the first 2 posts but do you have your average swing speed numbers as well? Curious if the ball speed is coming from a better smash factor or something else.

Thanks for the kind words, we have some really cool thinks planned with the​ Foresight units!

Its not something I typically track or worry about because for me it's all about the way the head reacts and produces speed on different strikes so I elected to leave my SS out of it.

Its at an ok level though, not internet golfer high, but solid hahahaha

 

[robrandalgz]

Our driving range uses real (non-range) Titleist golf balls (which is absurdly silly because people pocket them, but thats for another time and place).

I game the B330-S, no problem disclosing that as I have been extremely vocal about that ball on the forum for some time. That is what I used on the course today with the Epic, and I'll sort through that data tonight, hopefully to get it up tomorrow. Suffice to say, the averages at eyeball are right on par with what I saw on range.

Fantastic. Thanks again for the data and the response.

 

[Daddio]

I'm really enjoying the back n forth discussion you've got going here Jman. I've been doing a lot of similar driver comparative tests and some of what you are seeing correlates with my results; despite my very different swing and 'talent' level. I get slightly better average ball speeds from the Epic, even moreso with the Epic Sub Zero. For me the issue is control. The hotter and longer the driver for me, the greater the potential exists for me to miss bigger when I don't quite have the face square. I hit way too many hooks into trouble anyway (especially since I added significant swing speed) but I 'really' hook the Epic and the Sub Zero. Something I've noticed with a THPer I play with often (he's played so many new drivers) and he BOMBS his Epic but he would sometimes bomb a high soaring hook waay out there too.

This leads me to my question because you are looking at 'dispersion' very differently than I do when I compare drivers. Averaging '6 yards left of center' only tells part of the story because there are so many ways to get 'there'. Simply said a set of three shots with driver A could be 45yardsL, 45YyardsR, and 18yardsL and would average 6yards left but the actually average shot distance from center would be 36 yards with a lateral span of 90 yards. Driver B could be 10yardsL, 2yardsL, and 6yards left and average the same by your metric but be a massively better fit in a real golf situation. I'm not criticizing at all or saying it would be anything near that drastic but I wondered if you still had access to the raw numbers and could share what your largest miss right and left was with each driver and also how many drives with each might've exceeded 33 yards offline in one direction or the other. One metric I score on all the drivers I test is "trouble miss percentage" and I characterize 33 yards from center as a likely trouble miss (OOB, lost, etc...)

 

[Jman]

I'm really enjoying the back n forth discussion you've got going here Jman. I've been doing a lot of similar driver comparative tests and some of what you are seeing correlates with my results; despite my very different swing and 'talent' level. I get slightly better average ball speeds from the Epic, even moreso with the Epic Sub Zero. For me the issue is control. The hotter and longer the driver for me, the greater the potential exists for me to miss bigger when I don't quite have the face square. I hit way too many hooks into trouble anyway (especially since I added significant swing speed) but I 'really' hook the Epic and the Sub Zero. Something I've noticed with a THPer I play with often (he's played so many new drivers) and he BOMBS his Epic but he would sometimes bomb a high soaring hook waay out there too.

This leads me to my question because you are looking at 'dispersion' very differently than I do when I compare drivers. Averaging '6 yards left of center' only tells part of the story because there are so many ways to get 'there'. Simply said a set of three shots with driver A could be 45yardsL, 45YyardsR, and 18yardsL and would average 6yards left but the actually average shot distance from center would be 36 yards with a lateral span of 90 yards. Driver B could be 10yardsL, 2yardsL, and 6yards left and average the same by your metric but be a massively better fit in a real golf situation. I'm not criticizing at all or saying it would be anything near that drastic but I wondered if you still had access to the raw numbers and could share what your largest miss right and left was with each driver and also how many drives with each might've exceeded 33 yards offline in one direction or the other. One metric I score on all the drivers I test is "trouble miss percentage" and I characterize 33 yards from center as a likely trouble miss (OOB, lost, etc...)

Appreciate the kind words.

Epic: Largest: 13y L

M1: Largest: 14y R

 

[Daddio]

Appreciate the kind words.

Epic: Largest: 13y L

M1: Largest: 14y R

Thanks Jman. 13 and 14, 260 carry, I'm so envious.

 

[Jman]

Thanks Jman. 13 and 14, I'm so envious.

Was a good day.

Even then, on course today using the Foresight on every driver swing the biggest miss I saw with him the Epic was 25, and it was definitely a pull, hahahha

 

[AvionicsMan]

From purely a numbers point of view this post is great and thanks again Jman for doing this. It would be interesting to have the ability to use "iron Byron" for this match up. The M1 vs Epic and maybe vary with three different shafts. Then compare the M1/Epic numbers and maybe see how the shafts line up. Thoughts??


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[Jman]

From purely a numbers point of view this post is great and thanks again Jman for doing this. It would be interesting to have the ability to use "iron Byron" for this match up. The M1 vs Epic and maybe vary with three different shafts. Then compare the M1/Epic numbers and maybe see how the shafts line up. Thoughts??


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I'm not a fan of the iron byron type machines for review purposes, for in-house R&D, sure, it makes sense, but in the real world I've still yet to play with anyone who swings like a remote controlled machine.

 

[AvionicsMan]

I'm not a fan of the iron byron type machines for review purposes, for in-house R&D, sure, it makes sense, but in the real world I've still yet to play with anyone who swings like a remote controlled machine.

Totally understand your point. My thought process was to keep the numbers as pure as possible. I hit like me, still an OTT swing path which keeps my 15.5 handicap right where it is. Your numbers will never be my numbers, and as an aviation guy I like to see what the numbers are without any variance. I am looking to move from my SLDR to something new and improved. I know the head can only do so much, really I'd like to see which shaft pairs better with the heads you tried. It would be kinda fun to have access to the swing machine for a couple hours, wouldn't it??


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