Tesla Model 3 now the best selling luxury car in the U.S.

[mpeterson]

The company footing is a little sketch, but everything else about the vehicles are definitely quality. I haven't known anyone who bought one who didn't love it. You definitely pay a premium but there is some payback.

The fit and finish on the 3s is... not great, at least the one I got to see. And I've read the same thing on a number of reviews. I think the big problem for Tesla long term is that eventually the companies that actually know how to build a car (and understand ergonomics when it comes to driving) will start building competitive electric cars. And then I think the road gets a lot harder for them.

That said, the model S is a fantastic car - and deserves the following it has. I'm not sure if the 3 will be the same way.

 

[JB]

The fit and finish on the 3s is... not great, at least the one I got to see. And I've read the same thing on a number of reviews. I think the big problem for Tesla long term is that eventually the companies that actually know how to build a car (and understand ergonomics when it comes to driving) will start building competitive electric cars. And then I think the road gets a lot harder for them.

That said, the model S is a fantastic car - and deserves the following it has. I'm not sure if the 3 will be the same way.

I agree with this so much. The S is just incredibly nice. The 3 at 50k seems far less premium than just about every other car in that price class. It still rides like a Tesla, which is a different driving experience, but the fit, finish and ergonomics were just not great in comparison.

 

[Wake]

Yes I was speaking of the S and X.

I'm with you the 3 doesn't seem to be the hit those were. I expected to own one, but it's not on the radar now.

The fit and finish on the 3s is... not great, at least the one I got to see. And I've read the same thing on a number of reviews. I think the big problem for Tesla long term is that eventually the companies that actually know how to build a car (and understand ergonomics when it comes to driving) will start building competitive electric cars. And then I think the road gets a lot harder for them.

That said, the model S is a fantastic car - and deserves the following it has. I'm not sure if the 3 will be the same way.

 

[tequila4kapp]

The numbers are really interesting. I would have thought only on what I see when I drive (Both on interstate and city driving) that some brands would have been much higher and Telsa would have been about where Volvo is. I cant afford one nor do I want one. Seems small suvs are the way to go right now.

I see a million Teslas on the road when I visit my friend in CA (Silicon Valley) and they are becoming more prevalent here in Portland. I dont see them so much when I travel to places that have different socio-economic demographics.

 

[mjkladis]

The fit and finish on the 3s is... not great, at least the one I got to see. And I've read the same thing on a number of reviews. I think the big problem for Tesla long term is that eventually the companies that actually know how to build a car (and understand ergonomics when it comes to driving) will start building competitive electric cars. And then I think the road gets a lot harder for them.

That said, the model S is a fantastic car - and deserves the following it has. I'm not sure if the 3 will be the same way.

The one I saw in Florida during the Morgan Cup didn't have any fit/finish issues that I noticed and the same goes for the one I saw parked in Dallas.
I know that's only 2 cars but it seems like Tesla is starting to get their manufacturing right.

I totally understand why some people won't like the Model 3 but I honestly love this car! The minimalist styling is amazing to me and the idea of the car constantly getting better through OTA updates sounds pretty cool! If anyone has rode or drove an electric car, you will understand that the instant torque feels like nothing else out there too. It's a blast!


This might not be the electric car for the people yet but it's awesome to see the progress that's been made.

 

[tequila4kapp]

They will be banging the hell out of electric car owners soon. It has been discussed the last year or so and am surprised it hasn't hit yet. The state is so efficiently run I can't believe they haven't noticed the lost revenue to all the electric cars.

My guess is they will jack up the registration costs for electric car owners. So instead of paying almost $300 a year for my 6 year old car it will probably quadruple (I own a 2013 chevy volt because I have solar power at my place).

Mileage tax, my friend. That's what was proposed here. We have a pilot program underway where the state places devices on the car to track the odometer and you get a bill based on the amount you drive.

 

[mpeterson]

The one I saw in Florida during the Morgan Cup didn't have any fit/finish issues that I noticed and the same goes for the one I saw parked in Dallas.
I know that's only 2 cars but it seems like Tesla is starting to get their manufacturing right.

I totally understand why some people won't like the Model 3 but I honestly love this car! The minimalist styling is amazing to me and the idea of the car constantly getting better through OTA updates sounds pretty cool! If anyone has rode or drove an electric car, you will understand that the instant torque feels like nothing else out there too. It's a blast!


This might not be the electric car for the people yet but it's awesome to see the progress that's been made.

For me the "everything is on the touch screen" thing is an absolute deal breaker. I get that it's a differentiator, but you're taking your eyes off the road to make any small change, since you can't do anything by feel.

 

[mjkladis]

For me the "everything is on the touch screen" thing is an absolute deal breaker. I get that it's a differentiator, but you're taking your eyes off the road to make any small change, since you can't do anything by feel.

Good point but I will challenge you with this question.
What small changes do you need to make while driving?

Lights/High beams- Auto
Wipers- Auto
Volume or Switch music- steering wheel controls

I guess HVAC controls could be one thing but it can also be adjusted prior to driving.

 

[mancest]

Mileage tax, my friend. That's what was proposed here. We have a pilot program underway where the state places devices on the car to track the odometer and you get a bill based on the amount you drive.

Devices on cars is going to require a) devices and b) someone/something to monitor them.

My guess has been they will just figure out an amount per car for electric cars and tack it on to registration. But we will see what happens.

 

[Wake]

Mileage tax, my friend. That's what was proposed here. We have a pilot program underway where the state places devices on the car to track the odometer and you get a bill based on the amount you drive.

I'm going to say that will NOT be a positive program among the masses.

 

[Roadrunner]

My buddy in Indiana bought a Model S when he retired, and he took me for a test drive. It's not in my financial wheelhouse right now, but I would highly recommend the Model S to anyone - - that's pretty much the only Tesla model I see around Tucson.

 

[mpeterson]

Good point but I will challenge you with this question.
What small changes do you need to make while driving?

Lights/High beams- Auto
Wipers- Auto
Volume or Switch music- steering wheel controls

I guess HVAC controls could be one thing but it can also be adjusted prior to driving.

Even with auto climate control, during fall/spring I end up making a number of adjustments, especially driving in to work in the morning as the temperature/sunlight changes and the defroster has to often be tweaked. Doing so on a touch screen would be infuriating. I guess my main argument is, the big tablet in the middle is essentially a cost-savings device for the company - it's cheaper to do that than put controls and gauges in the dashboard. Why should I expect that in a 50-60K car?

 

[mjkladis]

Even with auto climate control, during fall/spring I end up making a number of adjustments, especially driving in to work in the morning as the temperature/sunlight changes and the defroster has to often be tweaked. Doing so on a touch screen would be infuriating. I guess my main argument is, the big tablet in the middle is essentially a cost-savings device for the company - it's cheaper to do that than put controls and gauges in the dashboard. Why should I expect that in a 50-60K car?

Great point! You're right that using a touchscreen right now is difficult and yeah the screen is definitely a cost savings device (marketing won't say that) but this car was designed to be ready for full autonomy whenever that finally comes. The steering wheel is just needed for the time being.
Most people buying it now are either early adopters or people who just want a Tesla.

 

[N54tt]

I just picked up the performance model 3 last week and had sold my 2008 335i for it. 335i was fully loaded and ran a tune for a nice bump in power. IMO The performance model 3 is just as sporty/luxurious as my BMW was. It rides nice but yet handles very well, quiet and not a rattle box, seats are comfortable but still hold you pretty good. It just goes about it a different way. Model 3 is very minimalist. Center screen is a turn off for some....it was for me initially too. I think people see the minimalist as not being as luxurious. The model 3 has all the features my bmw had plus more. All 5 seats individually heated. It senses rear seat passengers and will turn off rear vents if there’s no passangers, can pre heat/cool the cabin remotely from your phone, auto highbeam to name a few....oh and it can drive itself lol.

Looks wise...yeh it’s not as pretty as the s. Build wise it’s not up to par with BMW imo. But what really sold me above all, and made it worth spending the $$, is the Performance. On the street, daily driving there’s no other compact sport sedan that can outperform it and with such ease. It’s already shown to hold its own or better even on the autocross, road course and 1/4mile. The ev side is a bonus for me. Free charging at work, cheaper to charge at home than the premium gas I had to run in my BMW. And convenience of leaving everyday with a full tank.

Not for everyone... But for me. Until BMW comes out with an AWD m3. There’s no other luxury compact sport sedan I would want.

 

[JB]

Tesla Model 3 now the best selling luxury car in the U.S.

Glad you like it. I would hope a “luxury” car for 2019 would have all of the features of a near entry level luxury car 11 years older at this price range.

The most important thing is that their owners enjoy them.

 

[Desmond]

Drove a client's Tesla - the SUV type version Model X - it takes off like a rocket, lots of windows so for over $100k, I would want less noise. I understand the need for being minimalist in terms of luxury - for efficiency. My guess is that after time, the screen gets easier with familiarity. Am biding my time and waiting for more competition.

 

[Molten]

Glad you like it. I would hope a “luxury” car for 2019 would have all of the features of a near entry level luxury car 11 years older at this price range.

The most important thing is that their owners enjoy them.

What features are you referring to? (Saw earlier the seats but it has push button seat adjustments, including for lumbar so I was a bit confused).

 

[JB]

What features are you referring to? (Saw earlier the seats but it has push button seat adjustments, including for lumbar so I was a bit confused).

My thoughts on the features were similar to what I would say about Ford or Kia. Every feature is there if you are willing to pay for it (although I still think the Model 3 feels "cheap" inside). Would you consider the Kia Optima a luxury car? How about the Ford Fusion? Yet both have most of the same features being discussed.

Tesla brought the 3 to market. It was not a luxury car, based on the features and specs offered. Then said NOPE, you can't have that car until we sell to all of the people that will pay for bigger battery and to move to the front of the line. Im such a fan of the tech, but let's be honest, if ANY other company pulled that stunt they would be under the firing squad, right?

This is a luxury car based on price. The Model 3 was not aimed to be a luxury car, according to Musk. It was the car that brings Tesla to the masses...until they decided to not offer what they said they would : )

EDIT: Maybe with all of that said, the term luxury car is what is no longer warranted. If we relate it to golf, perhaps its a brand or logo or price rather than the features available.

 

[Molten]

My thoughts on the features were similar to what I would say about Ford or Kia. Every feature is there if you are willing to pay for it (although I still think the Model 3 feels "cheap" inside). Would you consider the Kia Optima a luxury car? How about the Ford Fusion? Yet both have most of the same features being discussed.

Tesla brought the 3 to market. It was not a luxury car, based on the features and specs offered. Then said NOPE, you can't have that car until we sell to all of the people that will pay for bigger battery and to move to the front of the line. Im such a fan of the tech, but let's be honest, if ANY other company pulled that stunt they would be under the firing squad, right?

This is a luxury car based on price. The Model 3 was not aimed to be a luxury car, according to Musk. It was the car that brings Tesla to the masses...until they decided to not offer what they said they would : )

I certainly don’t disagree with a lot of what you say about Musk and the antics of Tesla. What’s worse (to me at least), the service center experience has gotten WAY worse and that was a gigantic plus for the brand before. I just don’t agree with the comparison to a Kia Optima or Ford Fusion. Eh, reasonable minds. I’m certainly not disillusioned about the long term prospects of the company or a die hard fan (anymore at least) but I haven’t had any issues with quality or needed repairs outside of the annual service in 5 years, which was a drastic change from the Acura and Lexus that Teslas replaced.

The 3 does indeed lack some luxury features but if it’s an economy car, it has to be at the top of the heap. Surprisingly, I prefer the 3 to the S in most respects. Unsurprisingly, I dislike the X wholesale - building on the same chassis was a terrible call.

 

[JB]

I certainly don’t disagree with a lot of what you say about Musk and the antics of Tesla. What’s worse (to me at least), the service center experience has gotten WAY worse and that was a gigantic plus for the brand before. I just don’t agree with the comparison to a Kia Optima or Ford Fusion. Eh, reasonable minds. I’m certainly not disillusioned about the long term prospects of the company or a die hard fan (anymore at least) but I haven’t had any issues with quality or needed repairs outside of the annual service in 5 years, which was a drastic change from the Acura and Lexus that Teslas replaced.

The 3 does indeed lack some luxury features but if it’s an economy car, it has to be at the top of the heap. Surprisingly, I prefer the 3 to the S in most respects. Unsurprisingly, I dislike the X wholesale - building on the same chassis was a terrible call.

I think the S is a fantastic car, although I do believe most do not understand the cost per transport. Tesla Calculator (according to Marketwatch) says its about $2 to go 50 miles. The tax credit depending on state can mean a bit more of a bargain. A lot of it has to do with how well your area is outlined for free charging or charging in general.

My thoughts are the company is cool for what they did. Once they hit mass market, are they still cool? Apple has continued to be, but if everybody has a Tesla, does it lose its luster? Musk has been at the forefront of discussing this as a car for the masses, until the numbers suited the business. I was merely echoing his own comments. It was about the masses until it benefitted him and frankly most (including me) would do the same thing I am sure (in touting stats).

If we look at it in terms of golf, I view the 3 as the players distance iron when it first came out. It offers a little bit of its own category. You can bet if it were the top selling car in regular sedan market, it would tout that just as it did the luxury. I think its 3rd right now, behind Camry, etc. CNBC had a great segment on it with Phil Lebeau, who knows more about auto business than I think just about anybody. He echoed similar thoughts and maybe that is where my opinion was finalized. Fair or unfair obviously.

 

[Molten]

I think the S is a fantastic car, although I do believe most do not understand the cost per transport. Tesla Calculator (according to Marketwatch) says its about $2 to go 50 miles. The tax credit depending on state can mean a bit more of a bargain. A lot of it has to do with how well your area is outlined for free charging or charging in general.

My thoughts are the company is cool for what they did. Once they hit mass market, are they still cool? Apple has continued to be, but if everybody has a Tesla, does it lose its luster? Musk has been at the forefront of discussing this as a car for the masses, until the numbers suited the business. I was merely echoing his own comments. It was about the masses until it benefitted him and frankly most (including me) would do the same thing I am sure (in touting stats).

If we look at it in terms of golf, I view the 3 as the players distance iron when it first came out. It offers a little bit of its own category. You can bet if it were the top selling car in regular sedan market, it would tout that just as it did the luxury. I think its 3rd right now, behind Camry, etc. CNBC had a great segment on it with Phil Lebeau, who knows more about auto business than I think just about anybody. He echoed similar thoughts and maybe that is where my opinion was finalized. Fair or unfair obviously.

Agreed that the luster is gone. It disappeared a few years ago in my eyes. And cost does depend on location and driving conditions - I save a ton of money on fuel day to day with bumper to bumper traffic as the norm coming from less than gas friendly cars (although it takes roughly 50k miles to see any of that savings when factoring elevated purchase price and ongoing fuel in a real world comparison). My cost per 50 miles in the S is about $1.8 so that estimated cost sounds spot on (the 3 has a slightly lower cost, at about $1.4 in my experience).

The company is at a bit of a crossroads I think and some new leadership might be good. Very little about it is unique anymore and very little separates it from the pack. Musk did what he had to do to keep the doors open and promote sales but now the company needs to change up and do better. If the company was to go belly up, we might have some issues.

As with everything in life, it’s about what you expected and whether those expectations are met. Personally, as an owner it has. As an investor, it hasn’t. And I’m slightly nervous about the future - it’s saving grace might be the infrastructure it has built for fast charging but that is a discussion for another day.

 

[JB]

Agreed that the luster is gone. It disappeared a few years ago in my eyes. And cost does depend on location and driving conditions - I save a ton of money on fuel day to day with bumper to bumper traffic as the norm coming from less than gas friendly cars (although it takes roughly 50k miles to see any of that savings when factoring elevated purchase price and ongoing fuel in a real world comparison). My cost per 50 miles in the S is about $1.8 so that estimated cost sounds spot on (the 3 has a slightly lower cost, at about $1.4 in my experience).

The company is at a bit of a crossroads I think and some new leadership might be good. Very little about it is unique anymore and very little separates it from the pack. Musk did what he had to do to keep the doors open and promote sales but now the company needs to change up and do better. If the company was to go belly up, we might have some issues.

As with everything in life, it’s about what you expected and whether those expectations are met. Personally, as an owner it has. As an investor, it hasn’t. And I’m slightly nervous about the future - it’s saving grace might be the infrastructure it has built for fast charging but that is a discussion for another day.

Agree there. The house battery is fascinating to me. I was saddened that their last management hire lasted only a month or so.

 

[N54tt]

Glad you like it. I would hope a “luxury” car for 2019 would have all of the features of a near entry level luxury car 11 years older at this price range.

The most important thing is that their owners enjoy them.

Class wise the model 3 is competing with the BMW 3 series and C class. We shouldn’t consider the model 3 luxury and 3 series entry level luxury. Whether it be 2008 model year or 2019 model year.....the model 3, 3 series and c class are all entry level cars from a luxury car company.

I’m not sure if I missed it. Alot has changed in the past 10yrs and many less expensive cars ie ford and Kia like you have mentioned...have the same features(some more) than even the 2019 3 series and c lass have. What features do you think the model 3 is missing that it wouldn’t be considered entry level luxury as well? Someone correct me if I’m wrong...even the 3 series doesn’t have a self closing trunk.

 

[tahoebum]

I have several friends and and neighbors who own a Model S and we have put 76k on our 3 year old Model S. The main reason for purchasing a Model S for the owners I know is not to be green but the performance of the vehicle coupled with low maintenance costs. The closest competition for a Model S performance wise would be a BMW M5, and AMG Mercedes, or an S or RS Audi. Those cars cost as much or more than a Model S but are way more expensive to maintain. We have spent $170 on maintenance and service on our Model S in 76,000 miles and this is typical for other Model S owner that I have talked to. My neighbor who has an M5 BMW has spent over $5,000 on service and maintenance in 3 years(for fewer miles than we have on our Tesla)which is also typical. I’ve done the math for us and had we been driving a gas powered M5 or similar the last 3 years we would have also spent an additional $11,000 on fuel over what we’ve paid for electricity to run our Tesla. That works out to about $5,000 a year in fuel/maintenance savings. Assuming depreciation is about the same, a Tesla is much cheaper to own than something like an M5 or AMG Mercedes. I know 2 Tesla Model S owners who have over 120,000 miles on theirs and they still drive and perform like new with almost no maintenance or service costs. Neither has yet to replace even brake pads. High performance without the expense to operate and maintain. In a sense us Telsa owners are having our cake and eating it too.

 

[Molten]

I have several friends and and neighbors who own a Model S and we have put 76k on our 3 year old Model S. The main reason for purchasing a Model S for the owners I know is not to be green but the performance of the vehicle coupled with low maintenance costs. The closest competition for a Model S performance wise would be a BMW M5, and AMG Mercedes, or an S or RS Audi. Those cars cost as much or more than a Model S but are way more expensive to maintain. We have spent $170 on maintenance and service on our Model S in 76,000 miles and this is typical for other Model S owner that I have talked to. My neighbor who has an M5 BMW has spent over $5,000 on service and maintenance in 3 years(for fewer miles than we have on our Tesla)which is also typical. I’ve done the math for us and had we been driving a gas powered M5 or similar the last 3 years we would have also spent an additional $11,000 on fuel over what we’ve paid for electricity to run our Tesla. That works out to about $5,000 a year in fuel/maintenance savings. Assuming depreciation is about the same, a Tesla is much cheaper to own than something like an M5 or AMG Mercedes. I know 2 Tesla Model S owners who have over 120,000 miles on theirs and they still drive and perform like new with almost no maintenance or service costs. Neither has yet to replace even brake pads. High performance without the expense to operate and maintain. In a sense us Telsa owners are having our cake and eating it too.

I’ll second this. Brakes are still original on mine too and I’ve had $0 in maintenance cost outside my service plan.