The continued demonization of golfers and weight training

[mpeterson]

I think it's more about physical fitness than "weight training" as a whole. I know I've bounced around the idea of getting more physically fit without the big weights, but I've always been afraid of how it's going to impact my game overall.

The only time getting in shape really had an effect on my game was when I lost a considerable amount of weight. Since then, I've bounced around within 15 or so pounds, and the major difference I see when I'm working out vs. not is that I'm less tired after walking. No huge effect on the rest of the game.

 

[Architex]

Gym time has nothing to do with increased risk of injury. Everyone is different and some people are more prone to injury than others.

 

[leftshot]

As far as I'm concerned, the more movement, the better

Well, it's a little more complicated than that. Not all weight training is equal. For example, CrossFit has been in the news a lot because the frequency of injury in their program is much higher than most. To be fair, they promote a fairly intense program. Some weight training techniques actually detract from the flexibility golfers need. Other programs are designed specifically for golfers. We've only scratched the surface. But I think it's clear not all weight training--much less exercise programs are created equal.

 

[leftshot]

I should have added that I incorporate weight training into my exercise regimen for the last 15 years and have benefitted greatly. But I am very careful to utilize training exercises that are both safe and beneficial. As you can imagine, golfers HATE to be injured and sidelined.

 

[mr.hicksta]

Well, it's a little more complicated than that. Not all weight training is equal. For example, CrossFit has been in the news a lot because the frequency of injury in their program is much higher than most. To be fair, they promote a fairly intense program. Some weight training techniques actually detract from the flexibility golfers need. Other programs are designed specifically for golfers. We've only scratched the surface. But I think it's clear not all weight training--much less exercise programs are created equal.

Oh it most definitely is, and I’m guessing the pros are not just doing whatever they want when they’re training. While all trainers are not created equal, I suspect PGA players are giving specific exercises to do and are definitely not out there trying to lift the world. I just believe any training they do is designed to enhance what they get paid to do, yet weight training is made out to be public enemy number one by certain analysts. It’s ridiculous.

 

[DataDude]

I saw the latest comment from Chamblee about how many majors Tiger would've won had he not started weight training (https://www.golfchannel.com/article...mblee-lifting-weights-cost-tiger-many-majors/).

Combined with the multiple threads I've seen about certain swing coaches philosophies resulting in back injuries, I'm wondering...why is weight training considered a negative when golfers are doing it? As far as I'm concerned, the more movement, the better and I fail to see how the weight training these golfers are doing is causing them problems. As a golf junkie who spends quite a bit of time in the gym, I personally find this logic flawed. I'm curious to hear the takes on why this may be. Is it because it involve Tiger? Or is it because the prototypical PGA player is 6ish feet and 160ish pounds soaking wet? Let's discuss!

For reference weight training is fine imo. I started the thread about Foley's swing. I don't like the movement through the ball of that swing and how constructed it is. I think players lose flow and their natural movements from his swing. Muscle training should be easier on your back. Less strain there. In fact when my back started hurting 8 years ago, losing weight, starting to weight train, and stretching my hips extensively moved me to the non-pain camp. I also have moved to a free flowing swing that is more about how it starts and how it finishes than where I am in between. I have picked up power and added consistency.

 

[Tadashi70]

I weight trained after college and never struck the ball better. I went away from it for 4 years and maintained my power but lost some consistency. Picked it up again after my left knee was scoped. My power increased and consistent ball striking returned. Went through another stint of no lifting and got back into it after my hip was replaced.

Weight training has always benefited my game and elevated it. As I get older I have to stretch more to keep my fluidity and stay away from extreme pain after the round.

Brandflakes is full of himself and hot air. His favorite person, other than himself, is Tiger. I think he wishes he was closer to TW and hopes this will somehow bring them together.

@Hicksta I see nothing wrong with weight training and playing successful golf.

 

[OITW]

I weight trained after college and never struck the ball better. I went away from it for 4 years and maintained my power but lost some consistency. Picked it up again after my left knee was scoped. My power increased and consistent ball striking returned. Went through another stint of no lifting and got back into it after my hip was replaced.

Weight training has always benefited my game and elevated it. As I get older I have to stretch more to keep my fluidity and stay away from extreme pain after the round.

Brandflakes is full of himself and hot air. His favorite person, other than himself, is Tiger. I think he wishes he was closer to TW and hopes this will somehow bring them together.

@Hicksta I see nothing wrong with weight training and playing successful golf.

LMAO brandflakes

I agree - if you do it properly it will be beneficial- I think chambles is the worst of the talking heads on tv there is a reason a lot of the pros come at him on twitter

 

[NewGlfr]

Yep, because being physically fit with lean body mass is a terrible thing. Chamblee is a moron.

 

[sleuth]

I have never heard of fitness or weight training making someone's current and future state worse. This argument is just silly.

 

[wstrom42]

Kinetics is the key to any sport.. You train for specific sport. Golf required heavy usage of our fast twitch muscles and must be trained accordingly. Speed, agility, flexibility, strength and quickness drills. From lunges to resistance bands and all in between while eliminating all the dead lifts, bench press, push ups and heavy weights. Low weight with many reps. But each body works to a different speed.
I am 76 and train 3-4 times a week. Still hit the ball a ton with great ball flight with no lower back pain...

 

[mpeterson]

Kinetics is the key to any sport.. You train for specific sport. Golf required heavy usage of our fast twitch muscles and must be trained accordingly. Speed, agility, flexibility, strength and quickness drills. From lunges to resistance bands and all in between while eliminating all the dead lifts, bench press, push ups and heavy weights. Low weight with many reps. But each body works to a different speed.
I am 76 and train 3-4 times a week. Still hit the ball a ton with great ball flight with no lower back pain...

I'm not sure why eliminating one of the best full body exercises (the push up) or some of the big lifts is a good idea. You need power to get out of the hole in a squat, or to get the bar off the ground in a deadlift. That said, if you don't have someone to work with you on form and check in with regularly, I'd be hesitant to suggest back squats or deadlifts to someone who is just picking up weights.

 

[Badger_Golfer]

My understanding is that weight training and adding muscle puts so much more stress on your back and your joints that it can cause joint problems. Thats why Tiger has had back and knee surgery, IMO.
Weight training is fine but there is a difference between weight training and body building. Sure, lifting weights and working on your flexibility may allow you to drive the ball a mile when youre in your 20s but by your mid 30s, 40s and 50s, what kind of toll does it take on your body, to the point where it reduces your golf career? IMO, if you were to build the perfect body for a golfer, it would be one that is long, lean and flexibility. Being buff isnt neccesarily a good thing because it reduces your flexibility and puts a lot of stress on your joints and your back.

 

[DG_1234]

My understanding is that weight training and adding muscle puts so much more stress on your back and your joints that it can cause joint problems. Thats why Tiger has had back and knee surgery, IMO.

I think Tiger's knee injuries are at least in part due to his former routine of running 6 to 7 miles a day.

 

[DucatiGirl]

My understanding is that weight training and adding muscle puts so much more stress on your back and your joints that it can cause joint problems. Thats why Tiger has had back and knee surgery, IMO.
Weight training is fine but there is a difference between weight training and body building. Sure, lifting weights and working on your flexibility may allow you to drive the ball a mile when youre in your 20s but by your mid 30s, 40s and 50s, what kind of toll does it take on your body, to the point where it reduces your golf career? IMO, if you were to build the perfect body for a golfer, it would be one that is long, lean and flexibility. Being buff isnt neccesarily a good thing because it reduces your flexibility and puts a lot of stress on your joints and your back.

A lot of NFL players are using yoga to stay flexible, and those guys are body builders who rely on strength. It’s not mutually exclusive. My kickboxing coach is 5’7” and weighs 190 pounds, and he’s crazy flexible, moreso than me. His core flexibility and strength is jaw dropping.

Jogging and running puts more strain on the body (especially with poor form) than weight lifting. Poor form in anything is dangerous, of course, but for the most part, you are better off lifting weights than cardio as nauseam.

 

[NewGlfr]

My understanding is that weight training and adding muscle puts so much more stress on your back and your joints that it can cause joint problems. Thats why Tiger has had back and knee surgery, IMO.
Weight training is fine but there is a difference between weight training and body building. Sure, lifting weights and working on your flexibility may allow you to drive the ball a mile when youre in your 20s but by your mid 30s, 40s and 50s, what kind of toll does it take on your body, to the point where it reduces your golf career? IMO, if you were to build the perfect body for a golfer, it would be one that is long, lean and flexibility. Being buff isnt neccesarily a good thing because it reduces your flexibility and puts a lot of stress on your joints and your back.

If "weight training" is done smartly and with proper knowledge and guidance it can be a life long endeavor. I used to bodybuild. A lot. To the point where I considered Amateur competition. I trained with Mr. Canada a few times back then and he encouraged me to compete. I was also a personal trainer for years. I never got injured training. I got injured competing in MMA and Downhill skiing. Injuries sustained in those sports not only caused me to quit those sports competitively, but also forced me to curtail my bodybuilding because of the lay offs I had to go through due to the injuries.

Tiger's knee and back issue are 100% torque related. If you look at his swing when he was younger, you'll see how hard he snapped that left knee every swing. The rotation he put his back through was also extreme. Proper weight training won't relieve that kind of torque put on joints. Not ever.

 

[mpeterson]

My understanding is that weight training and adding muscle puts so much more stress on your back and your joints that it can cause joint problems. Thats why Tiger has had back and knee surgery, IMO.
Weight training is fine but there is a difference between weight training and body building. Sure, lifting weights and working on your flexibility may allow you to drive the ball a mile when youre in your 20s but by your mid 30s, 40s and 50s, what kind of toll does it take on your body, to the point where it reduces your golf career? IMO, if you were to build the perfect body for a golfer, it would be one that is long, lean and flexibility. Being buff isnt neccesarily a good thing because it reduces your flexibility and puts a lot of stress on your joints and your back.

I do not see how strengthening your muscles, including your back, puts more stress on the back. If anything it provides stability. Generally, the people I know in their mid-30s, 40s and later who are in the gym regularly seem to have fewer, not more, physical issues than the sedentary folks I know at work and in my friend circles.

I think Tiger's knee injuries are at least in part due to his former routine of running 6 to 7 miles a day.

Running was something they mentioned specifically as something he's not doing any more when they were talking about the changes to his routine. I know running is one of the things that really bothers my wife's back (she's had a discectomy), whereas rotational work like golf doesn't bother her at all.

 

[emart2173]

I do not see how strengthening your muscles, including your back, puts more stress on the back. If anything it provides stability. Generally, the people I know in their mid-30s, 40s and later who are in the gym regularly seem to have fewer, not more, physical issues than the sedentary folks I know at work and in my friend circles.



Running was something they mentioned specifically as something he's not doing any more when they were talking about the changes to his routine. I know running is one of the things that really bothers my wife's back (she's had a discectomy), whereas rotational work like golf doesn't bother her at all.

Been in the gym the last two years with the first year focused on weight loss and the last year or so bouncing between weight maintenance and a4 month cut working on trying to establish a body composition that makes me happy. Squats, dead lifts, bench and overhead press have all been staples of the various routines I've done and in my early/mid 40s I've seen no no stress issues on bones/joints and only positives in the way I feel and how it's improved my speed and stance along with consistency.

The type of running tiger was doing was even more stressful that the typical runner experiences which is not realy good on the body

 

[DataDude]

Knees are the reason I use the elliptical or walk on an incline on the treadmill for cardio instead of jogging. Leg strength is correlated with longevity for a reason.

 

[leftshot]

Oh it most definitely is, and I’m guessing the pros are not just doing whatever they want when they’re training. While all trainers are not created equal, I suspect PGA players are giving specific exercises to do and are definitely not out there trying to lift the world. I just believe any training they do is designed to enhance what they get paid to do, yet weight training is made out to be public enemy number one by certain analysts. It’s ridiculous.

Agreed with one exception. Training with Seals was by all accounts something Tiger wanted to do and was not recommended by anyone in his circle. Also, as someone old enough to have observed Tiger's entire career I can tell you there were LOTS of people who said the way Tiger swung the club, especially the squat and hyperextension of the left knee, portended back and knee problems down the road. I doubt Tiger's physical ailments are any more complicated than that.

 

[mr.hicksta]

The continued demonization of golfers and weight training

Agreed with one exception. Training with Seals was by all accounts something Tiger wanted to do and was not recommended by anyone in his circle. Also, as someone old enough to have observed Tiger's entire career I can tell you there were LOTS of people who said the way Tiger swung the club, especially the squat and hyperextension of the left knee, portended back and knee problems down the road. I doubt Tiger's physical ailments are any more complicated than that.

I agree 100%! I’m sure the public will ever know for sure exactly how much trying to play SEAL contributed to his injuries, but I’m of the belief it was the straw that broke the camels back.

 

[Rusty Dave]

I agree 100%! I’m sure the public will never know for sure exactly how much trying to play SEAL contributed to his injuries, but I’m of the belief it was the straw that broke the camels back.

This. It was his obsession with SEAL training that did him in IMHO.

 

[emart2173]

Imagine if brooks didn't bench 315 for reps before a round in a major or 225 before a us open round now good he could be.

 

[Molten]

Imagine if brooks didn't bench 315 for reps before a round in a major or 225 before a us open round now good he could be.

Exactly! That’s why I never bench 315. Still pushing for greatness. Seriously thought, I think it’s silly to demonize peak fitness.


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[rollin]

I think there is a big difference between staying healthy/keeping fit, and weight training. Different forms of weight training for different reasons. I do believe weight training needs to be specific for the task. Most anyone should be able to have a steady gym regiment (along with good diet) to stay fit and healthy but that is quite different from body building. And I think just like when we gain or lose weight , building or losing muscle mass does affect how we move the different parts of our bodies. and yes imo that can be beneficial or also detrimental to our golf swings. We all know the golf swing needs to be fluid and with good timing. And weight training (and the different types of weight training) may help or hurt a given individual's golf game. Imo there just is no definite answer because its all much individually based. Like everything else in golf.......what works for one doesn't for another.

As for one person determining just exactly what did or didn't help another? No one can truly now that for sure. There is just no way of knowing this. So is the comment possibly true? it absolutely can be. But all it really is , is just a guess cause no one can ever really know.

I do think its funny though, how some people seem to almost get personally insulted when negative weight training comments are made. Like may other things we tend to take insult when something we like is thrown an unfavorable comment. As said, I don't believe anyone can truly know but like it or not it is possible.