The continued demonization of golfers and weight training

[mpeterson]

I think there is a big difference between staying healthy/keeping fit, and weight training. Different forms of weight training for different reasons. I do believe weight training needs to be specific for the task. Most anyone should be able to have a steady gym regiment (along with good diet) to stay fit and healthy but that is quite different from body building. And I think just like when we gain or lose weight , building or losing muscle mass does affect how we move the different parts of our bodies. and yes imo that can be beneficial or also detrimental to our golf swings. We all know the golf swing needs to be fluid and with good timing. And weight training (and the different types of weight training) may help or hurt a given individual's golf game. Imo there just is no definite answer because its all much individually based. Like everything else in golf.......hat works for one doesn't for another.

As for one person determining just exactly what did or didn't help another? No one can truly now that for sure. There is just no way of knowing this.

I think a lot of people could benefit from just a basic general program - one of the guys I'm a big fan of advocates 5 main moves - push, pull, hinge, squat, loaded carry. Nothing sport specific, but gets people stronger for basically every movement they might want to do. I think more than being specific for the task, if you're going to add weight training, you need to make sure you're not getting a mix of all of the movements. For me, when I've added weights and made sure I've done full range of motion exercises, I've gained flexibility.

 

[Hamfist]

Wouldn't ANY resistance training be considered "weight training"? So, body-weight/resistance bands/medicine ball/etc. would qualify.

 

[blugold]

In my simple opinion, I am very biased on this, EVERYBODY should be squatting, deadlifting, and pressing. There is nothing dangerous, or hindering, about strength training. People who say things like, "getting strong limits flexibility" or "strength training puts too much stress on joints" have no idea what they are talking about and should not participate in the discussion.

Strength is the most important physical attribute. Not specifically in golf, but in life.

 

[Hamfist]

In my simple opinion, I am very biased on this, EVERYBODY should be squatting, deadlifting, and pressing. There is nothing dangerous, or hindering, about strength training. People who say things like, "getting strong limits flexibility" or "strength training puts too much stress on joints" have no idea what they are talking about and should not participate in the discussion.

Strength is the most important physical attribute. Not specifically in golf, but in life.

Overhead pressing?

 

[blugold]

Overhead pressing?

Overhead pressing and bench pressing. If I had to choose one of the two, overhead pressing. When done correctly, it is perfectly safe for the shoulder joint and employs the longest kinetic chain possible for an exercise.

 

[Bucketsofjoy]

I think people are eager to use this as justification for not working out.

Would you be a better golfer if you were stronger? Yes? Go lift weights.

 

[JMB3]

In my simple opinion, I am very biased on this, EVERYBODY should be squatting, deadlifting, and pressing. There is nothing dangerous, or hindering, about strength training. People who say things like, "getting strong limits flexibility" or "strength training puts too much stress on joints" have no idea what they are talking about and should not participate in the discussion.

Strength is the most important physical attribute. Not specifically in golf, but in life.

I'm with you on strength training, but for most of us, it shouldn't be the only way we train our bodies.

During my 5-year golf hiatus, I got back into strength training big time. Never been stronger in my life. I was great at squats back in HS, but terrible at bench. But with consistent work, I was putting up some combine numbers. So when I got back into golf, I thought, hell I'll be bombing 300+ yard drives no problem. Way wrong. I was topping out at like 235, down a good 25 yards. I started to realize how tight my body was. I couldn't even straighten my arms. My shoulders were hunched forward because of an imbalance between my chest and back. The problem was, the only way I worked out was strength training. And I focused way too much on 3-rep and 1-rep maxes. I did lose a lot of flexibility, which inevitably resulted in a lost of a lot of speed.

My workouts have changed a lot. Not a lot of heavy lifting. More medicine ball work, circuits, and yoga. It's definitely helped my swing, and I've gained considerable yardage back.

I've actually been wanting to find the right balance of strength training and golf, so I ordered Joey D's book, which goes through the types of workouts he puts Brooks and DJ through. Strength is a big component, but so is explosive, athletic movements. I'm excited to work that stuff in.

Btw, strength training can be hella dangerous if you don't do things the right way. I blew my back out as a 17 yro box-squatting 405; came down to quickly and kind of bounced off the box. I'm still paying for that injury 16 years later.

 

[JayB]

I wonder what Brandel will have to say about Brooks.....

 

[blugold]

I'm with you on strength training, but for most of us, it shouldn't be the only way we train our bodies.

During my 5-year golf hiatus, I got back into strength training big time. Never been stronger in my life. I was great at squats back in HS, but terrible at bench. But with consistent work, I was putting up some combine numbers. So when I got back into golf, I thought, hell I'll be bombing 300+ yard drives no problem. Way wrong. I was topping out at like 235, down a good 25 yards. I started to realize how tight my body was. I couldn't even straighten my arms. My shoulders were hunched forward because of an imbalance between my chest and back. The problem was, the only way I worked out was strength training. And I focused way too much on 3-rep and 1-rep maxes. I did lose a lot of flexibility, which inevitably resulted in a lost of a lot of speed.

My workouts have changed a lot. Not a lot of heavy lifting. More medicine ball work, circuits, and yoga. It's definitely helped my swing, and I've gained considerable yardage back.

I've actually been wanting to find the right balance of strength training and golf, so I ordered Joey D's book, which goes through the types of workouts he puts Brooks and DJ through. Strength is a big component, but so is explosive, athletic movements. I'm excited to work that stuff in.

Btw, strength training can be hella dangerous if you don't do things the right way. I blew my back out as a 17 yro box-squatting 405; came down to quickly and kind of bounced off the box. I'm still paying for that injury 16 years later.

Every negative you detailed here was a result of doing something wrong. Strength training didn't cause an imbalance and you to not extend your arms. Your exercise choices and execution did. The injury you suffered box squatting 405 incorrectly caused an injury. Strength training correctly does not cause imbalances or allow box squats to be performed incorrectly. Those are perfect examples of poor decisions in regards to strength training. I wouldn't recommend anybody do those things.

In my opinion, Joey D is a sham artist and a snake oil salesman. I wouldn't buy anything with his name on it.

 

[mr.hicksta]

I wonder what Brandel will have to say about Brooks.....

He'd have to get hurt or perform poorly for the correlation to be made :wink:

 

[JayB]

How did brooks hurt his wrist early in the season? Wonder if brandel will jump on that, and ascribe his injury to weight lifting and him not getting 3 majors this year.


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[emart2173]

How did brooks hurt his wrist early in the season? Wonder if brandel will jump on that, and ascribe his injury to weight lifting and him not getting 3 majors this year.


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He had a torn tendon that had been an issue long before he made it public. I don’t recall how it happened but would guarantee it wasn’t lifting weight.

 

[JMB3]

Every negative you detailed here was a result of doing something wrong. Strength training didn't cause an imbalance and you to not extend your arms. Your exercise choices and execution did. The injury you suffered box squatting 405 incorrectly caused an injury. Strength training correctly does not cause imbalances or allow box squats to be performed incorrectly. Those are perfect examples of poor decisions in regards to strength training. I wouldn't recommend anybody do those things.

In my opinion, Joey D is a sham artist and a snake oil salesman. I wouldn't buy anything with his name on it.

I think that's fair. I wasn't necessarily lifting with a goal of being a better golfer or even athlete; I was just doing it to boost the metabolism, build a bigger body, and enjoy the high of gains. It was fun.

I can tell you're passionate about this, and I think that's great. I highly value strength training too, and I wasn't really trying to disagree with you. I guess my point is, if a former athlete who strength trained since he was 15 years old can do things "wrong," via exercise choices or execution, its even more likely that a 45 year old golfer who has never picked up a weight in his/her life will do the same. In no way do I think strength training is bad for golf, but to your point, I think most golfers would need help with the selection of exercises and their proper execution.

 

[blugold]

I think that's fair. I wasn't necessarily lifting with a goal of being a better golfer or even athlete; I was just doing it to boost the metabolism, build a bigger body, and enjoy the high of gains. It was fun.

I can tell you're passionate about this, and I think that's great. I highly value strength training too, and I wasn't really trying to disagree with you. I guess my point is, if a former athlete who strength trained since he was 15 years old can do things "wrong," via exercise choices or execution, its even more likely that a 45 year old golfer who has never picked up a weight in his/her life will do the same. In no way do I think strength training is bad for golf, but to your point, I think most golfers would need help with the selection of exercises and their proper execution.

This is important. In my opinion, you are correct. In general, I don't believe that there are "golf specific" muscles or exercises and the marketing of such approaches is where I believe people become duped and fall victim. The basics work just fine.

 

[mr.hicksta]

He had a torn tendon that had been an issue long before he made it public. I don’t recall how it happened but would guarantee it wasn’t lifting weight.

Right, I believe it was just wear and tear from practicing and playing.

 

[bobellis75]

not to mention...I think guys have become smarter about how they train...they are training a lot in ways that are golf specific. In addition to flexibility, of course...they are hitting the weight room I think and targeting things to help them with the sport.

 

[mpeterson]

This is important. In my opinion, you are correct. In general, I don't believe that there are "golf specific" muscles or exercises and the marketing of such approaches is where I believe people become duped and fall victim. The basics work just fine.

Yeah, I think programming is where the disconnect is. The good news is, it's easier to find someone who knows what they're talking about than it was even 10 years ago.

I enjoy strength training as a hobby, but I will admit I only know the basics in terms of program design - I am happy to pay someone to do that for me. But as a biologist, it drives me nuts when I talk to a bunch of golfers and hear the suggestion for improving fast twitch muscle performance to be "low weight, high reps". That's endurance work... Type I muscle fibers.

 

[rollin]

I think people are eager to use this as justification for not working out.

Would you be a better golfer if you were stronger? Yes? Go lift weights.

how do you know that being stronger makes anyone better at golf?
being stronger doesn't at all "have to" make anyone a better player. Timing, fluidness, SS, and an outright ability to contact the ball correctly at point of impact and do it consistently is what can make you better. "If" getting stronger just so happens to help the given individual with those things, then yes it helped make "that player" better. Being generally healthy and fit should help most people play better but stronger? thats not at all any definite means to better and could for some people even work the other way.

 

[mr.hicksta]

Yeah, I think programming is where the disconnect is. The good news is, it's easier to find someone who knows what they're talking about than it was even 10 years ago.

I enjoy strength training as a hobby, but I will admit I only know the basics in terms of program design - I am happy to pay someone to do that for me. But as a biologist, it drives me nuts when I talk to a bunch of golfers and hear the suggestion for improving fast twitch muscle performance to be "low weight, high reps". That's endurance work... Type I muscle fibers.

I've been lifting since I was 12, but I gladly pay a trainer now and my main goal is improving my overall health. I'm with you on programming, too. I think I could toss a workout together without much issue, but it probably wouldn't be the most effective! I can say without question that my weight training has helped me on the course in just about every aspect.

And I see a recurring theme in some posts about technique and such. I think it almost goes without saying that if someone is doing an exercise or lifting an amount of weight outside their comfort zone, then it's not a matter of if, but when they'll get injured. Like any exercise with a Bosu ball for instance :wink:.

 

[blugold]

not to mention...I think guys have become smarter about how they train...they are training a lot in ways that are golf specific. In addition to flexibility, of course...they are hitting the weight room I think and targeting things to help them with the sport.

Just to beat that dead horse even more, in my opinion, there are no such things as "golf specific" muscles. Mimicking golf movements in the gym is a tremendous waste of time and any coach who says to do those things is not qualified to have opinions on training. All of that is just my opinion.

 

[mjkladis]

A stronger body can handle faster swing speeds.
Yes ball striking and tempo are one thing but physics will always win out.
If you want more distance (which is shown to lower scores), get faster.
The only way to get faster and stay there is to get stronger.

 

[blugold]

A stronger body can handle faster swing speeds.
Yes ball striking and tempo are one thing but physics will always win out.
If you want more distance (which is shown to lower scores), get faster.
The only way to get faster and stay there is to get stronger.

I know this is going to be a wet blanket for some, but not everybody will have the genetic makeup to produce a high swing speed. Some people will never be able to swing fast, just is what it is.

 

[rollin]

In my simple opinion, I am very biased on this, EVERYBODY should be squatting, deadlifting, and pressing. There is nothing dangerous, or hindering, about strength training. People who say things like, "getting strong limits flexibility" or "strength training puts too much stress on joints" have no idea what they are talking about and should not participate in the discussion.

Strength is the most important physical attribute. Not specifically in golf, but in life.

I wont pretend to know the answers for certain because I simply just don't know. But with due respect you say your very bias and all I can say is that you can find as much negative information as positive information when it comes to weight training and all the different exercises there are. For every positive one you can find a negative one. I don't think weight training in general is bad but I think whether or not its good for playing golf all depends on the individual and what thwey are doing and how it affects them.

What I do cringe at when I go to the gym (non golf related) is the things I too often see people do . I mean people will do the craziest positions and movements (most self invented of course) that just simply go against how our bodies are suppose to move especially when it comes to the spine, back and neck. . All I can say to some these crazy moves is..."we don't to grow a new spine" after damaging the only only one we got. Other than that, knock yourself out.

 

[mjkladis]

I know this is going to be a wet blanket for some, but not everybody will have the genetic makeup to produce a high swing speed. Some people will never be able to swing fast, just is what it is.

Swinging fast is really a relative term.
Someone's fast swing might be low 90s or even in the 80s. To them, that's still fast.

 

[emart2173]

Right, I believe it was just wear and tear from practicing and playing.

Yeah and he is pretty active outside of golf from what I gather. Injuries just happen sometimes...see DJ at Augusta

Just to beat that dead horse even more, in my opinion, there are no such things as "golf specific" muscles. Mimicking golf movements in the gym is a tremendous waste of time and any coach who says to do those things is not qualified to have opinions on training. All of that is just my opinion.

I’ve seen several strength coaches mention there’s no such thing as sports specific training. Certain sports require different muscles to be used but overall strength training has benefits across most sports


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