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Putts Per Round - Overrated Number?

Good bump of an old thread. I think it can be a useful stat, but I think there are several other putting stats that golfers do not keep that can really help their game.
 
Mark_UK said:
Putts per round means sweet FA. Putts per GIR is far more telling as it excludes holes where you miss the green then chip it close.
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Yep, this is what I was going to comment on. My last full 18 hole round, I had a whopping 26 putts. I also only hit something like 3 greens, missing most within 5 yards leaving an easy chip up to the hole. There's also the odd chutt from 10 feet off the green that might go in. That's not really a putt, though the putter was used, right?
 
T0AD said:
Yep, this is what I was going to comment on. My last full 18 hole round, I had a whopping 26 putts. I also only hit something like 3 greens, missing most within 5 yards leaving an easy chip up to the hole. There's also the odd chutt from 10 feet off the green that might go in. That's not really a putt, though the putter was used, right?
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If it is off the green it is not a putt, no matter what club is in your hand.
 
Howzat said:
If it is off the green it is not a putt, no matter what club is in your hand.
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LOL, what if you chip it close and tap it in with your wedge!? :clown:
 
Great timing for this thread to re-emerge. Our club uses How Did I Do for score entry and handicap management. The following stats are on my profile;

Hole in 1's: 0 Eagle or Better: 1 Birdies: 35 Pars: 272 Bogeys: 289 DB's or Worse: 103
Par 3 Avg: 3.7 Par 4 Avg: 4.7 Par 5 Avg: 5.6 (Putt Avg: 2.0, G.I.R: 3.0%) *Embellished Rounds Only


The GIR just doesn't seem right but the putt avg seems to be bang on. I am very conscious that I am pretty much guaranteed 36 putts every round at worse and this is something I am working on to improve.
I am hoping to get the putt average down to 32 and this should make a big difference on my scores.
The GIR obviously needs some work ha ha

I think I'll make a point of only counting actual putts on the green this year too. Anything off the green I'll enter as a chip to the green for tracking purposes.
 
I think putts per round is more important for the better player. The better player should have more "makeable" putts than the hacker.. JMHO
 
My thinking is # of putts doesn't tell the whole truth, until you put it with GIR, chips, pitches or chutts(vomit).

Now when you compare those stats round for round and stroke for stroke then you can gain find where your short game is lacking or it's strength.
 
Going back to "JB's" open for this this thread I think its different for everyone. Not every one is a good chipper/short pitcher and gets it close from around the greens. Many are happy with just getting the chips/pitches on and are not regularly left with short putts. So the stat could be more misleading for him and others like him because of good chipping leaving a lot of short putts but that probably just isnt the case for a lot of hackers out there. So for those people (myself included) we are putting from every where and the stat holds a bit more water for them imo.

But what can you do? Many stats in many sports are filled with variables and are misleading.
Like a quarterback's completion percentage. It doesnt show the dropped balls by recievers.
Like a baseball pitcher's total wins. A very misleading stat imo because it doesnt show whether or not he got great or poor run support.
Like a hockey goalie total blocked shots. It doesnt show quality saves vs the tons my grandmother could make or the ones he never saw hit him.

We can go on and on but what can you do? You just have to understand where you are at with everything else and take any stat with the grains of salt they sometimes come with and decide how, why, and what it is worth to you.
 
Strokes gained is really the only meaningful putting stat out there, but it's not an easy one to work with as an am.
 
What I've found works well for me is to add putts and chips (I define as a shot inside 5 yards of the green) then subtract GIR.


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Hawk said:
Strokes gained is really the only meaningful putting stat out there, but it's not an easy one to work with as an am.
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This is why amatuers should focus on the what happens on the putts they miss vs. the ones they make. It is a a little more tedious, but can be very helpful.
 
as i look back at my stats from last year through my golfshot app, i think my putts per round is highly understated. I was pretty terrible with GIR's, often ending up just off the green, ending up with a chip and a one putt often. Just looking at the stats, looks like i had a lot of sub 30 putt rounds...when in reality, I really didn't put great.
 
You know what phrase I have never understood...especially in advertising or in teaching/lesson/swing help discussions....

"MAKE MORE PUTTS"

I have yet to find a way to make more putts. No matter how I approach a round, what technique I use, and how poorly or perfectly I'm rolling the ball, 18 putts is the most I have ever made in a round....hahahaha
 
darnall said:
You know what phrase I have never understood...especially in advertising or in teaching/lesson/swing help discussions....

"MAKE MORE PUTTS"

I have yet to find a way to make more putts. No matter how I approach a round, what technique I use, and how poorly or perfectly I'm rolling the ball, 18 putts is the most I have ever made in a round....hahahaha
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You make a higher percentage of putts by missing less. They should be marketing missing less, not making more.


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I think putts per round tell you a lot if associated with other stats. I had 24,25 putts last two rounds. I pair that with 4 & 5 GIR and a 76 & 75 for score. My stats ate pretty strong. But they also tell me there is a big hole in my game, accuracy with irons.
 
Tadashi70 said:
I think putts per round tell you a lot if associated with other stats. I had 24,25 putts last two rounds. I pair that with 4 & 5 GIR and a 76 & 75 for score. My stats ate pretty strong. But they also tell me there is a big hole in my game, accuracy with irons.
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Nice job on the short game. As I became a better golfer my PPR rose by 4 or more strokes. That's why I am going with putting strokes gained this year.
 
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Tadashi70 said:
I think putts per round tell you a lot if associated with other stats. I had 24,25 putts last two rounds. I pair that with 4 & 5 GIR and a 76 & 75 for score. My stats ate pretty strong. But they also tell me there is a big hole in my game, accuracy with irons.
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I am right there with you brother ! I am putting lights out but I have to because my approach shots need work. A great number of my pars are up and downs. The short game work I have been putting in with both the wedges and putter is paying off. If I could get more of those approaches on the green, I'd be dangerous !
 
JB said:
I have always battled the putts per round number as a telling statistic. On one hand it tells you clearly how many times you are using your putter. But in my game of golf, I think that is the only thing it does. Why dont I keep a Drives per round, or wedges per round? Let me explain ( my weird thinking anyway).

PPR does not tell me if I am making good putts or bad putts. It does not take into factor any type of scoring whatsoever. I decided to do a little study. My last 5 rounds out (clearly a small sampling), the rounds that I had less putts per round, I had a higher score than the rounds I had more putts per round. Why?

Because in the rounds with less putts, it did not mean I made more birdies. It in fact meant I missed more greens and was chipping on close rather than having a 12-20 foot putt for birdie or par.

To me it is a very misleading statistic. On one hand we all want to make more putts, but on the other hand, someone could quite easily have 18 putts total if they missed every green and chipped on. GIR is a far more telling number and maybe the two combined give some players some semblance of what their round is going to end up or what they have to work on, but I just dont get it.

I think its another number that we worry far too much about when playing rather than just hitting greens and 2 putting. Maybe this is more of a thought than a thread, but I just do not see how the total putts per round plays that much role in score unless you are hitting every green and 3 putting. Because if you miss the green, odds are you are going to have less putts per round, thus rewarding the statistic for taking away from another one.

Thoughts on my rambling?
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If you read the book Every Shot Counts by Mark Broadie, he agrees with your thinking. The PGA now uses the strokes gained putting (at least that is what I hear when I watch golf).

I actually keep track of my putts per hole, and make an estimate at the length of each putt. If I am missing a bunch of 3-5'ers then I have a problem on the green....
 
I believe you have to look at all the stats as a big picture. They all go hand in hand in my mind. Form instance, a low fairway hit % probably leads to less GIR, but someone who is a good scrambler will have a better GIR despite missing fairways. Likewise a high FH and GIR naturally should lead to a lower PPR, but someone with a high PPR in that case may truly suck at putting and that's the glaring hole in their game. So I don't think you can isolate one stay without considering how the other stats are affecting one another. The more you keep the clearer the picture.




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JB said:
I have always battled the putts per round number as a telling statistic. On one hand it tells you clearly how many times you are using your putter. But in my game of golf, I think that is the only thing it does. Why dont I keep a Drives per round, or wedges per round? Let me explain ( my weird thinking anyway).

PPR does not tell me if I am making good putts or bad putts. It does not take into factor any type of scoring whatsoever. I decided to do a little study. My last 5 rounds out (clearly a small sampling), the rounds that I had less putts per round, I had a higher score than the rounds I had more putts per round. Why?

Because in the rounds with less putts, it did not mean I made more birdies. It in fact meant I missed more greens and was chipping on close rather than having a 12-20 foot putt for birdie or par.

To me it is a very misleading statistic. On one hand we all want to make more putts, but on the other hand, someone could quite easily have 18 putts total if they missed every green and chipped on. GIR is a far more telling number and maybe the two combined give some players some semblance of what their round is going to end up or what they have to work on, but I just dont get it.

I think its another number that we worry far too much about when playing rather than just hitting greens and 2 putting. Maybe this is more of a thought than a thread, but I just do not see how the total putts per round plays that much role in score unless you are hitting every green and 3 putting. Because if you miss the green, odds are you are going to have less putts per round, thus rewarding the statistic for taking away from another one.

Thoughts on my rambling?
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Dude this is a big lightbulb moment for me. I often get frustrated when I see 33 or 34 putts on the card even when shooting a good score and hitting a ton of greens, it's not relevant really and like you and Freddie when I heva a low putts round I have a low GIR round. I never ever really thought about this stuff.
 
Agreed. I always kept track of them til I had a round where I had 19 putts and still shot 75. I was missing greens and leaving myself 5 footers all day. To me, GIR is the key factor for me to score well. The two combined let's me know which part of my game needs attention.

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dizzyg12 said:
I believe you have to look at all the stats as a big picture. They all go hand in hand in my mind. Form instance, a low fairway hit % probably leads to less GIR, but someone who is a good scrambler will have a better GIR despite missing fairways. Likewise a high FH and GIR naturally should lead to a lower PPR, but someone with a high PPR in that case may truly suck at putting and that's the glaring hole in their game. So I don't think you can isolate one stay without considering how the other stats are affecting one another. The more you keep the clearer the picture.
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I think the "bold" part is the opposite of what is being implied by many. In general hitting greens will probably leave one further from the pin vs chipping/pitching on from close around the greens especially for those who are good from close around. Chipping from close to within a few feet of the pin will happen a lot more often for a good close/short gamer vs sticking one to a few feet from 150yrds out and even 100 or whatever out. And lets not forget we can further add even more to that point because one also will not always pin hunt with approach shots either. Often one will seek out the safest area to try to get on and stay on. So hitting more greens for many can lead to higher ppr.
 
rollin said:
I think the "bold" part is the opposite of what is being implied by many. In general hitting greens will probably leave one further from the pin vs chipping/pitching on from close around the greens especially for those who are good from close around. Chipping from close to within a few feet of the pin will happen a lot more often for a good close/short gamer vs sticking one to a few feet from 150yrds out and even 100 or whatever out. And lets not forget we can further add even more to that point because one also will not always pin hunt with approach shots either. Often one will seek out the safest area to try to get on and stay on. So hitting more greens for many can lead to higher ppr.
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Good point and I agree that for the average player that is probably very true, however the point remains that a higher % of GIR will effect the PPR in some fashion. Getting on in regulation and having a high PPR let's you know that either your putting needs work or you approaches could be better. A lot of players will take it a step further and track distance of putts for this very reason. A high PPR with a average 1st putt if 20 ft is certainly a different story than an avg first putt of 8 ft.

It may bode well for many if us to track chips to get the full story but I can often deduce that if I am missing green ins regulation and have a low PPR that my short game must be doing well and # of Chips isn't a necessary stat at that point because I'm sticking it close enough one way or another. Now if my PPR is on the higher side (still assuming a low GIR) than that's an indicator of a week short game and not necessarily putting.

Again the more you track the clearer the picture. It helps to take notes of your round too and not just stats.





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Well, As I've said earlier. Some stats need to be taken with the grains of salt that they sometimes come with. Some stats are not so black and white but rather they are shaded by other factors. One has to know and understand just why, how, and what it all means to only themselves if he wants to use them to help better himself. Its a very different thing with a different view vs how ones onlookers and peers may view those same stats because they dont hold value in the same ways or for the same reasons as they do for the player himself.
 
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