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Driver Ad Wars!

SuperStroke
JB said:
They are not that far off now really. Two years ago they were well behind, but not anymore.

I was never really a big fan outside of the wedges until last years line. Very solid. Then this years line (as you can tell by the demo day results) incredible.

Very curious what they do with the marketing as they dont market like the others you mentioned. Comes from their heritage.
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Agreed thats why I think this is an important year for them. They are known for the wedge, but now they have the best hybrid in the game, great drivers with incredible shafts behind them, good if not great irons, and still the wedges. They need a campaign this year almost the opposite of last years saying, that they are not just wedges and you can put their stuff up against everyone else's.
 
coolbreeze said:
Agreed thats why I think this is an important year for them. They are known for the wedge, but now they have the best hybrid in the game, great drivers with incredible shafts behind them, good if not great irons, and still the wedges. They need a campaign this year almost the opposite of last years saying, that they are not just wedges and you can put their stuff up against everyone else's.
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Agreed. I think that would be a great start.

To me the one thing that separates what they CAN offer is that they own a premium shaft company. Not sure any other OEM has that luxury. Getting a $250 shaft in a $299 driver is staggering.

Still dont think they will make the move to completely move into the top 3 this year (hard goods only), but it should be really close.

A lot of this goes back to the thread we had a few weeks ago called Year of the Driver.
 
coolbreeze said:
Agreed thats why I think this is an important year for them. They are known for the wedge, but now they have the best hybrid in the game, great drivers with incredible shafts behind them, good if not great irons, and still the wedges. They need a campaign this year almost the opposite of last years saying, that they are not just wedges and you can put their stuff up against everyone else's.
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They kind of are using their marketing success of their wedges and marketing their CG16 irons. Watch the CG16 video on the hompage from the PGA show, it's very clear that Cleveland has made those as an extension of the iron set. It's quite genius to me......I know if I bought CG16 irons, I would probably fill out with the wedges. Conversely, if I loved the 15 wedges and wanted conforming 16's it would make sense to consider adding the iron set.

It's like they hook ya with these killer wedges for all these years, then BOOM, irons that match what might be the most popular wedges out there right now.


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JB said:
Agreed. I think that would be a great start.

To me the one thing that separates what they CAN offer is that they own a premium shaft company. Not sure any other OEM has that luxury. Getting a $250 shaft in a $299 driver is staggering.

Still dont think they will make the move to completely move into the top 3 this year (hard goods only), but it should be really close.

A lot of this goes back to the thread we had a few weeks ago called Year of the Driver.
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I have a $200 shaft in my $299 driver...House of Forged HD Prototype in an Alpha 830.2 Plasma, which Golf Digest called the "best driver you never heard of." :)
 
Sean said:
I have a $200 shaft in my $299 driver...House of Forged HD Prototype in an Alpha 830.2 Plasma, which Golf Digest called the "best driver you never heard of." :)
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Components are a different animal Sean, they dont offer the same thing and are not sold the same way. Anybody can put a high end shaft in any head.

Its about standard shaft offerings and only one OEM can do tour level shafts at that price point that I have seen so far.
 
coolbreeze said:
Agreed thats why I think this is an important year for them. They are known for the wedge, but now they have the best hybrid in the game, great drivers with incredible shafts behind them, good if not great irons, and still the wedges. They need a campaign this year almost the opposite of last years saying, that they are not just wedges and you can put their stuff up against everyone else's.
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It will be a hard year to sell irons. I have the feeling that there are still going to be more changes like texturing/microgroove that will be coming. Without a huge breakthrough in irons I'm gonna spend my money in the drv-fw-hyb section. I hope to see more lower profile drivers as I think this will help me most. Year of the driver Indeed.
 
JB said:
Components are a different animal Sean, they dont offer the same thing and are not sold the same way. Anybody can put a high end shaft in any head.

Its about standard shaft offerings and only one OEM can do tour level shafts at that price point that I have seen so far.
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I wasn't aware of that JB. Still the gentleman who built my driver gave me an exceptional deal. At retail it would have cost me more than $400.
 
TC said:
They kind of are using their marketing success of their wedges and marketing their CG16 irons. Watch the CG16 video on the hompage from the PGA show, it's very clear that Cleveland has made those as an extension of the iron set. It's quite genius to me......I know if I bought CG16 irons, I would probably fill out with the wedges. Conversely, if I loved the 15 wedges and wanted conforming 16's it would make sense to consider adding the iron set.

It's like they hook ya with these killer wedges for all these years, then BOOM, irons that match what might be the most popular wedges out there right now.


serious golfers use tapatalk so we can THP on the fly!
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Yep there doing a really good job with CG 16 marketing and of course the wedges, I just don't know if the standard consumer knows about their drivers, woods and hybrids all with real Miyazaki shafts. They have marketing people much better at this stuff than me working for them, but I would love to see them show casing how great their other products are compared to their competitor especially in the shaft department.
 
coolbreeze said:
Yep there doing a really good job with CG 16 marketing and of course the wedges, I just don't know if the standard consumer knows about their drivers, woods and hybrids all with real Miyazaki shafts. They have marketing people much better at this stuff than me working for them, but I would love to see them show casing how great their other products are compared to their competitor especially in the shaft department.
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Dude, I agree. If El Tiger had a Miyazaki shaft this would be an interesting thread wouldn't it?

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JB said:
I think they usually stay out of this stuff and market to a different sector (star power ads). Titleist markets traditional. Adams is changing a little, but still goes a different way. Cleveland should do it, but I dont think they will. They had so much success marketshare wise with their last ads (year of the wedge) I would venture to say they do that setup again.
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Cleveland doesn't have the power to make the type of move towards the bigger companies like Taylormade and Callaway. I think Cleveland is more of niche market (i.e. "year of the wedge"). But I think these type of battles are best left for Two companies (i.e. Pepsi v. Coke, Verizon v. ATT, Ford v. Chevy, so on and so on).
 
Mardin said:
Cleveland doesn't have the power to make the type of move towards the bigger companies like Taylormade and Callaway. I think Cleveland is more of niche market (i.e. "year of the wedge"). But I think these type of battles are best left for Two companies (i.e. Pepsi v. Coke, Verizon v. ATT, Ford v. Chevy, so on and so on).
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What do you mean by power?
 
TC said:
That.is.awesome! I deal with car dealers professionally and that's incredible.

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You saw the Audi billboard across the street form the BMW one right? Not that your not observant, just making sure.
 
coolbreeze said:
I just don't know if the standard consumer knows about their drivers, woods and hybrids all with real Miyazaki shafts.
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That's because most consumers has never hear of Miyazaki. Heck, 90% of the club fitters I've talked in the past couple months both local and abroad either have no idea who they are or have only vaguely heard of them.

I think Clevelands sucess is really going to have to be a two way street between themselves and Miyazaki this year. They have to not only show people that the clubs are great but show people and club fitters that the shafts are a cut above. If the people informing the average shopper at a GT, dicks, etc aren't on board they aren't going to have the success of TM or Calli (regardless of their idiotic ad's).
 
I like the ads,very entertaining.The real issue is which club will work for me.I like and have used both companies drivers,performance will always beat out marketing and brand loyalty to me.
 
Super Tuna said:
That's because most consumers has never hear of Miyazaki. Heck, 90% of the club fitters I've talked in the past couple months both local and abroad either have no idea who they are or have only vaguely heard of them.

I think Clevelands sucess is really going to have to be a two way street between themselves and Miyazaki this year. They have to not only show people that the clubs are great but show people and club fitters that the shafts are a cut above. If the people informing the average shopper at a GT, dicks, etc aren't on board they aren't going to have the success of TM or Calli (regardless of their idiotic ad's).
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Can I ask what this means (bolded part)? It seems a few people in the thread keep saying the same thing that someone has to step up and catch Callaway, TaylorMade, & Titleist. While that may be true with TM, the other two are not the same animal. I mean they are close now to being in the same ball park as Callaway. In fact really close. And with Titleist, nobody really knows their future.

As for the shaft, it has not been a retail shaft yet. Strictly a niche market shaft that was designed for the tour with some consumer usage sprinkled in because it was so popular. That changes in 2011.
 
JB said:
Can I ask what this means (bolded part)? It seems a few people in the thread keep saying the same thing that someone has to step up and catch Callaway, TaylorMade, & Titleist. While that may be true with TM, the other two are not the same animal. I mean they are close now to being in the same ball park as Callaway. In fact really close. And with Titleist, nobody really knows their future.

As for the shaft, it has not been a retail shaft yet. Strictly a niche market shaft that was designed for the tour with some consumer usage sprinkled in because it was so popular. That changes in 2011.
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JB are you talking tour sucess or retail? I see a ton of Cally/TM drivers and some Titleist drivers in amateur bags but I don't think I've seen anyone with a Cleveland/Srixon driver. And I have never seen anyone with a Miyazaki shaft. I know that will change come May but thus far I just have not seen any Cleveland/Srixon stuff in playing partners bags
 
Chunkylover77 said:
JB are you talking tour sucess or retail? I see a ton of Cally/TM drivers and some Titleist drivers in amateur bags but I don't think I've seen anyone with a Cleveland/Srixon driver. And I have never seen anyone with a Miyazaki shaft. I know that will change come May but thus far I just have not seen any Cleveland/Srixon stuff in playing partners bags
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Im speaking in terms of revenue. People dont realize it because of marketing that is done, but the revenue numbers overall (Cleveland & Callaway) are not that far off. And of course if you add global numbers (Srixon) than its a different story altogether. One has gone up in revenue over the last 5 years considerably and one has gone down.
 
WMac19 said:
Absolutely!

With Callaway touting the composite similarities with their clubs and Lamborghini, Cleveland or Srixon can say that they prefer the engine (meaning, the shaft) of an exotic sports car over it's carbon shell. :smile:
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That is very good. Have an last years model Mustang with new white paint and a TM logo, a Lambo without an engine with a Cally logo, and one of those rocket cars they use to break land speed records blow by them with the Cleveland logo.
 
TwoSolitudes said:
That is very good. Have an last years model Mustang with new white paint and a TM logo, a Lambo without an engine with a Cally logo, and one of those rocket cars they use to break land speed records blow by them with the Cleveland logo.
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While they wont do it that a hell of an idea!
 
TwoSolitudes said:
That is very good. Have an last years model Mustang with new white paint and a TM logo, a Lambo without an engine with a Cally logo, and one of those rocket cars they use to break land speed records blow by them with the Cleveland logo.
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Hahah that actually made laugh.
 
JB said:
Can I ask what this means (bolded part)? It seems a few people in the thread keep saying the same thing that someone has to step up and catch Callaway, TaylorMade, & Titleist. While that may be true with TM, the other two are not the same animal. I mean they are close now to being in the same ball park as Callaway. In fact really close. And with Titleist, nobody really knows their future.

As for the shaft, it has not been a retail shaft yet. Strictly a niche market shaft that was designed for the tour with some consumer usage sprinkled in because it was so popular. That changes in 2011.
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You'll know better then I about the true numbers but what I see in people's bags aren't Cleveland anything except wedges. According to the local GT, the Launcher last year had over a 50% return rate which is unheard of (again according to them) in the past few years. Now, the new driver is likely light years ahead of it but that isn't exactly the best platform to build ones new and improved line upon.

If they're going to be taken seriously by the average joe (I'm guessing that this is where most of OEM's sales come from) then Callaway, Titleist and Taylormade are exactly who they have to compete with. It's where everyone's eye wanders when they walk in to see the latest, greatest and shiny. If they are doing better then general perception says, great! I wish them continued succes as they put out a quality product without terrible ads. If they aren't, then maybe it's time for some silly or attention grabbing ads so people can see the real deal behind the new line.

I really think their whole 2011 line is a winner but outside of forum junkies no one seems to known about it which is sad to me.

Also looking forward to Miyazaki busting it out this year. The online fitting tool if done well is going to open a lot of people to be sucked in (much like the Mizuno shaft fitter).
 
My favorite is the "Winners play Callaway" ad.
 
Super Tuna said:
You'll know better then I about the true numbers but what I see in people's bags aren't Cleveland anything except wedges. According to the local GT, the Launcher last year had over a 50% return rate which is unheard of (again according to them) in the past few years. Now, the new driver is likely light years ahead of it but that isn't exactly the best platform to build ones new and improved line upon.

If they're going to be taken seriously by the average joe (I'm guessing that this is where most of OEM's sales come from) then Callaway, Titleist and Taylormade are exactly who they have to compete with. It's where everyone's eye wanders when they walk in to see the latest, greatest and shiny. If they are doing better then general perception says, great! I wish them continued succes as they put out a quality product without terrible ads. If they aren't, then maybe it's time for some silly or attention grabbing ads so people can see the real deal behind the new line.

I really think their whole 2011 line is a winner but outside of forum junkies no one seems to known about it which is sad to me.

Also looking forward to Miyazaki busting it out this year. The online fitting tool if done well is going to open a lot of people to be sucked in (much like the Mizuno shaft fitter).
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Yeah, the real numbers show something very different than that. As for return rates, that must be a local thing and there is no way to tell about a national number. But I can tell you two of those 3 companies you mentioned have gone in reverse in revenue of hard goods over the last 5 years while Cleveland & TaylorMade have climbed. They are close to Callaways number now and if you combine global sales are larger (combination of companies).

They have far more money behind them than the other 3 companies you mentioned by a huge margin, so that makes things a little brighter for them long term I believe.

As for who knows about them, I am not sure I agree with that assessment. The Hot List, while a debatable topic, has given them high remarks and we know that the annual sells clubs to the average joe. Their last iron set (CG7) was their best selling iron set in quite some time and their pre booked sales of their current clubs has already exceeded projections. While marketshare is climbing for two of those companies (Cleveland & Taylormade) it has fallen considerably for the other two.
 
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