Luke Donald-No Respect

[Damaikis]

I like this thread. Good, intelligent discussion here. I think Luke has a reasonable shot at winning. I don't, however, think he is the best golfer in the world. I think that's Rory.

One thing I can't seem to understand though: many people are citing the fact that Luke has never won a major as a reason that he won't win the Masters. I can't name a single golfer in the history of the world that had a major win before they won their first major. Everyone has to get a first, right? Lol.

 

[pjcedog]

Wasn't trying to change your mind. The fact that points are determined by the field, along with predetermined points doesn't leave for much of an argument. If I understand it correctly, which I may not, but PGA and Euro events (excluding The Players, BMW Championship and Major Championships) start with the same amount of points awarded to the winner.

In the past five years, there have been twenty majors. Seven have been won by Americans. The last 6 Players Championships has only had one American winner. If you include the two this year, there have been twenty WGC events. Nine have been won by Americans, BUT subtract Tiger and that number is only five.

I just don't see where you came up with that statement.

Euro events and Japan events are weaker fields so giving equal points for wins there is exactly the issue. I would say 7 of 20 majors won by the US against the rest of the world as the field is a pretty good number. Break it down further by Euro tour players, South African, South American and Asian players to be fair with that comparison and if you break out Northern Ireland as well you don't have many majors left for the European tour. WGC events are not majors and in my opinion should not count for more than any other event.

Statement is my opinion only.

 

[Badger_Golfer]

Euro events and Japan events are weaker fields so giving equal points for wins there is exactly the issue. I would say 7 of 20 majors won by the US against the rest of the world as the field is a pretty good number. Break it down further by Euro tour players, South African, South American and Asian players to be fair with that comparison and if you break out Northern Ireland as well you don't have many majors left for the European tour. WGC events are not majors and in my opinion should not count for more than any other event.

Statement is my opinion only.

Not sure that you could say Euro Tour events are weaker fields anymore.

 

[pjcedog]

Look at the past 10 winners of the Masters. There's two guys that might hit it as far or less or perhaps a little further off the tee than Luke Donald at that was ZJ and Weir. Both of which are 10x more accurate off the tee. I don't care about the height or thickness of the rough at Augusta, there's just certain portions of that golf course that will eliminate a guy from going at certain pins. It's not Luke's length off the tee, it's his accuracy that makes me doubt him to win here. Of course he can roll it, most of these guys can.

Luke is shorter than Weir was at the time he won - back when he had two healthy elbows. I don't expect Luke to win this week. I don't think Tiger will either though. I think it will be that Irishman, he did a pretty good job on that course for three days last year. Then it was like watching Chuck Norris turn into Barney Fife in that final round. He won't do that again.

 

[roggey]

Luke is shorter than Weir was at the time he won - back when he had two healthy elbows. I don't expect Luke to win this week. I don't think Tiger will either though. I think it will be that Irishman, he did a pretty good job on that course for three days last year. Then it was like watching Chuck Norris turn into Barney Fife in that final round. He won't do that again.

When Weir was on form, I don't remember him having any problems with length - am I just forgetting or do we just assume he wasn't long because he's a small guy? Edit: now I remember. Carry on.

Even if it doesnt effect his WGC points, a lot of people would always use that as a knock against him. Winning majors is what people remember years and decades into the future.
Personally, I wouldnt say that Luke is the clear cut best golfer in the world but he definetly has to be in the discussion. Sure, he isnt a long driver. So what? His irons, wedges and putter more than make up for that.

Completely agree - it's the major champs in all sports that make for greatness. And yes, distance off the tee isn't the most aspect in my mind, either, although a lot of the greatest players in their era were considered long. Let's remember, though, that all the modern stars train like athletes now - golf might have been considered a 'game' once upon a time, but it is certainly a legitimate 'sport' now.

 

[roggey]

Euro events and Japan events are weaker fields so giving equal points for wins there is exactly the issue. I would say 7 of 20 majors won by the US against the rest of the world as the field is a pretty good number. Break it down further by Euro tour players, South African, South American and Asian players to be fair with that comparison and if you break out Northern Ireland as well you don't have many majors left for the European tour. WGC events are not majors and in my opinion should not count for more than any other event.

Statement is my opinion only.

Is it the same number of points, though? If so, I think your point is made - but I didn't think that to be the case. To your second point, I don't think there are many out there that would argue that the US is the greatest single nation. Speaking of national competition - I haven't noticed it yet but I'm going to go see if there's an Olympics thread. If not, I'm starting one.

 

[DB]

This is going to be a great weekend ahead, I'll be golfing and coming back to watch my PVR Masters with a few Buds Sounds like a solid weekend.

It's hard to say what Luke will do.. He is such a great putter and his short games great which you have to have on this course or your done. But you also have to have accurate drives. Will the driving be "Consistent?" thats one thing i think can be really off in his game and if thats the case he is done. I have him top 10 still though solid 100 + grand ;P lol


I have this for my top 5:

Braadley
Woods
Kaymer
Rory
Garcia

 

[dirkules]

This is going to be a great weekend ahead, I'll be golfing and coming back to watch my PVR Masters with a few Buds Sounds like a solid weekend.

It's hard to say what Luke will do.. He is such a great putter and his short games great which you have to have on this course or your done. But you also have to have accurate drives. Will the driving be "Consistent?" thats one thing i think can be really off in his game and if thats the case he is done. I have him top 10 still though solid 100 + grand ;P lol


I have this for my top 5:

Braadley
Woods
Kaymer
Rory
Garcia

Finally someone giving Kaymer, a former No 1, some credit. But I guess at the masters it is only reasonable that he is flying under the radar.

 

[DB]

Finally someone giving Kaymer, a former No 1, some credit. But I guess at the masters it is only reasonable that he is flying under the radar.

Yup, i think if he played more NA tounys last 2 years he would be number 1 still. And could still be the best golfer out there (not a expert on the point setup tho). But i guess we will see this weekend. I feel even that he was number 1 he is the most underaited player out there.

Sorry off topic

 

[the_paulo]

I see why you would think that way but all you have to do is look at the lack of success in the US of many of the higher ranked players on that list. I think Luke Donald is a fine golfer and I like his personality but is he really the best player in the world? Believe me I know there are some great players outside the US - not saying there isn't - but the OWGR is obviously biased toward easy points earned in less than top notch tournaments outside the US and I happen to think that is on purpose. If it isn't then it is by accident which is even harder to believe.

Can I guess that you don't watch much worldwide golf? You'd be surprised at the depth of the better Euro fields, even though I'd agree that the PGA is deeper more often.

I could counter your argument by asking you to comment on the lack of success of the US guys in Europe. If the points are really in the Euro tour's favour, why aren't the US players competing more often in Europe?

I don't think there are many out there that would argue that the US is the greatest single nation.

I might. Success per head of population, I'd maybe be looking at England or Northern Ireland right now.

That said, compared to Europe, the US has a much better foundation for greatness. Europe are way behind in the way they nuture young talent.

 

[TC]

Finally someone giving Kaymer, a former No 1, some credit. But I guess at the masters it is only reasonable that he is flying under the radar.

Yep. Has he even played at Augusta on the weekend yet? Until he does, he'll stay off my radar. That place is a wee bit different on the weekend.

 

[Chunkylover77]

Not the biggest Donald fan but find it interesting that the #1 golfer in the world is getting no respect in terms of winning the Masters.

His game doesn't translate well to that course. He doesn't have the length to compete with the longer hitters.

 

[Golf Ghost]

Euro events and Japan events are weaker fields so giving equal points for wins there is exactly the issue. I would say 7 of 20 majors won by the US against the rest of the world as the field is a pretty good number. Break it down further by Euro tour players, South African, South American and Asian players to be fair with that comparison and if you break out Northern Ireland as well you don't have many majors left for the European tour. WGC events are not majors and in my opinion should not count for more than any other event.

Statement is my opinion only.

Euro events start with the same 24 WG ranking points, same as PGA events. Japan tour events are only given 16. It is then based on world rankings of players in the field to determine the strength of the field. I really don't understand where you keep coming up with some of these statements.

I included WGC events because you said about lack of Euro tour players wins in the US and three of the four yearly events are in the US.

 

[SW]

His game doesn't translate well to that course. He doesn't have the length to compete with the longer hitters.

Or he could lay up on every par 5 like Zach Johnson. 3rd shot with a wedge who would you rather have, Donald or Bubba?

 

[TC]

Or he could lay up on every par 5 like Zach Johnson. 3rd shot with a wedge who would you rather have, Donald or Bubba?

It's not his length, it's his accuracy off the tee that plagues him. I said this like a few posts ago. Lukey D will outplay Bubba this week. He's a better iron player and putter.

 

[ddec]

It's not his length, it's his accuracy off the tee that plagues him. I said this like a few posts ago. Lukey D will outplay Bubba this week. He's a better iron player and putter.

yup. He can win this tourny because he's such a good iron and wedge player. But if he doesn't miss in the right spots off the tee it won't help him at all.

 

[the_paulo]

I think Luke can win this. He finished well last year, and missing in the right spots can lead to some luck at Augusta. The more I think about it, the more I fancy his chances.

 

[JB]

yup. He can win this tourny because he's such a good iron and wedge player. But if he doesn't miss in the right spots off the tee it won't help him at all.

 

[TC]

LMAO!!!

 

[ddec]

I like to add insight that nobody else has

 

[pjcedog]

Can I guess that you don't watch much worldwide golf? You'd be surprised at the depth of the better Euro fields, even though I'd agree that the PGA is deeper more often.

I could counter your argument by asking you to comment on the lack of success of the US guys in Europe. If the points are really in the Euro tour's favour, why aren't the US players competing more often in Europe?



I might. Success per head of population, I'd maybe be looking at England or Northern Ireland right now.

That said, compared to Europe, the US has a much better foundation for greatness. Europe are way behind in the way they nuture young talent.

I watch probably as much Euro tour as I do US tour events. I dvr everything and then try to keep up with it all. I even watch LPGA. I think the best of the European players are great players, I just don't believe that after the top 10 to 20 or so players that there is the kind of talent that you have in the US, it falls off rapidly. US players don't go to Europe to play because their goal is to play well here. It is also probably an expensive proposition to travel to play there so I would think it is just not worth it for many players to even consider it. Unless you are Tiger and being paid appearance money.

 

[Ranger5022]

I read some interesting stats on Luke today ...number 1 putter on the US tour for the last three years.....he only three putts on average once every 87 holes...the US tour average is once every 30 holes ....
he played 449 holes of golf without three putting once......the next best was 131 holes
out of 529 putts at three feet or under he nailed 529 ...these are US tour stats.....for 2011.....damn the man can putt.....lol...who ever wins this weekend it's going to be great to watch....I wish them all the best of luck

 

[Drumdog]

Is Luke the #1 player in the world? Right now, of course he is......using the current standards.

Will he win at Augusta this year? I think so and here's why.

1. Arguably one of the best iron players in the world... that is crucial on those greens and pin placements.
2. Arguably one of the best putters in the world....enough said in #1.
3. Hasn't won a major....so he is due.
4. And this is the most important reason......I picked him on my team in the Ultimate THP Masters Contest !

 

[Golf Ghost]

120th in GIR this season = not good for Augusta.

 

[JB]

Is Luke the #1 player in the world? Right now, of course he is......using the current standards.

Will he win at Augusta this year? I think so and here's why.

1. Arguably one of the best iron players in the world... that is crucial on those greens and pin placements.
2. Arguably one of the best putters in the world....enough said in #1.
3. Hasn't won a major....so he is due.
4. And this is the most important reason......I picked him on my team in the Ultimate THP Masters Contest !

Genuine questions here. With those four reasons, why did he not win the last 2 years?