Golf ball spin - Is seeing believing?

[Hawk]

This is something that's been on my mind for a long time, so I thought it would make for an interesting conversation.

It's not uncommon to hear comments on the forums about a certain ball's ability to spin more or less than another, but does science really back up those observations? It's often associate by brand name, which also makes it more interesting to me. Obviously, a surlyn covered ball will spin less than a urethane ball, but what about the comparisons we often hear regarding balls of the same cover type? Granted, some urethane balls are designed with harder/softer covers for reasons associated with fitting/preference (I assume).

I did a tiny amount of research and it looks like most urethane covered balls (excluding outliers) fell into a 700 rpm window, though they also had varying average launch angles, which should alter our perception of 'spin' upon landing. Of course, this doesn't take into account varying conditions we all see. I was seeing what appeared to be high spin from an e6 over the weekend, but our greens were sopping wet, which greatly improved the ball's stopping quality. The same thing can occur when hitting the ball into a sloping green.

What say you? Can you tell a big difference between similar golf balls? Do you believe that certain urethane balls just don't spin?

Same goes for surlyn balls. Do you believe certain surlyn balls spin considerably more than other similar balls? How much effect do you think marketing has on your perception of spin?

 

[JB]

Fascinating thread and one that I look forward to follow along. You are right in your stats and in our testing it comes out very similarly. We hear all the time about brand X spinning more than brand Y and even this surlyn ball spins more than this urethane covered ball. It leads me to wonder about this all the time as it relates to people's perceptions.

 

[SethO]

I have never noticed one ball spinning more on the green than another (Tour balls). If I hit the ball clean with a full wedge, it lands and goes backwards. If I don't hit it clean, it lands and rolls out. This goes for every ball I have ever tried and I have tried them all. A person would have to be way better than me to tell the difference IMO.

 

[TRyan]

I have to agree with Seth. If I get solid, ball-first contact, it will either hop and stop, or backup.

If I don't hit it clean, it won't. Some balls will roll-out more than others, but I have found I can spin a B330 as well as a Pro-V or Z-Star or whatever tour level ball I find on the course. I don't notice difference in spin on them TBH

 

[Joshzilla]

Great topic! My assumption is usually that the clickier sound the ball makes on impact, the less it's going to spin off a wedge because I associate click with hardness of the cover (ie. urethane vs surlyn). I'm not really that consistent in my testing methods when it comes to golf balls but I have seen what appears to be a difference in spin between balls of a similar class. I've never had a ball spin as much as the 20XI-S, but when I was playing with that ball I could have just been in the wedge zone.

For a long time I felt (due to experience) that the B330-RX just did not do a very good job of checking up on the green. Recent experience seems to contradict that. It is something that I plan to test more in the future.

I think marketing plays a little bit into my perception of spin. It's also hard not to follow the herd and accept it as your own opinion. Most of all...I have a hard time deciding what I even think. Do I like the Penta? Sometimes! The minutia of this game are killer on my OCD!

 

[Hawk]

I think the 330 RX is a good example here just based on some comments I've read in the past. It's got a firmer cover than some other Tour balls, but I've stopped it dead with good contact. It may not have quite as many RPM's, but still performs like I'd expect a Tour ball to with the right technique.

 

[wadesworld]

I have to agree with Seth. If I get solid, ball-first contact, it will either hop and stop, or backup.

If I don't hit it clean, it won't. Some balls will roll-out more than others, but I have found I can spin a B330 as well as a Pro-V or Z-Star or whatever tour level ball I find on the course. I don't notice difference in spin on them TBH

So, should we all quit throwing money away and all be playing Precept Laddie X?

I'm not saying we should, just asking the question.

 

[Hawk]

So, should we all quit throwing money away and all be playing Precept Laddie X?

I'm not saying we should, just asking the question.

Not neccessarily, because the Laddie X isn't a urethane ball. Completely different things there.

 

[JRod]

I used to drink the kool aid until I got in a launch monitor. I think balls can perform drastically different off the driver but around the gresn if you hit the ball cleanly they all perform pretty similarly.

Edit: This is comparing apples to apples.

 

[SethO]

I used to drink the kool aid until I got in a launch monitor. I think balls can perform drastically different off the driver but around the gresn if you hit the ball cleanly they all perform pretty similarly.

Edit: This is comparing apples to apples.

I completely agree with JRod here. With wedges, how much are we really compressing the ball? We really only interact with the first layer or 2 right? The driver should compress all the layers which will make different balls react very differently. I always look for balls that react well off my driver because I know they will spin on the green.

 

[Puttin4Bird]

Love the topic Hawk. I've been playing a bunch of random balls here lately because I'm trying to clean out my bag of found balls or other randoms that have made it in my bag this season. I do notice the difference between a urethane ball and a surlyn cover ball but once you start comparing apples to apples (urethane to urethane) to the naked eye without launch monitor numbers I cannot tell a difference. I notice how one ball feels and sounds, but the performance of the spin is usually so close that it's nearly impossible for me to tell. For guys like us the fact is we're not putting the same exact swing/strike onto the ball each and every time so the amount of spin we'll likely get will change and change dramatically at times between shots. I have no doubt that golfers far better than me do indeed notice the differences and it could impact them a great deal, but for me I really don't.

 

[TRyan]

So, should we all quit throwing money away and all be playing Precept Laddie X?

I'm not saying we should, just asking the question.

I dont think the Laddie X is a tour ball, my comment had to do with tour level balls..

I also think that spin is one of many factors someone should use when choosing a ball. I suggest people get fit for a ball. I have found that for the price, the Q-Star and Gamer V2 work really well for my game. They don't spin back, but with good contact I see a nice check from them.

 

[Hawk]

I dont think the Laddie X is a tour ball, my comment had to do with tour level balls..

I also think that spin is one of many factors someone should use when choosing a ball. I suggest people get fit for a ball. I have found that for the price, the Q-Star and Gamer V2 work really well for my game. They don't spin back, but with good contact I see a nice check from them.

Q-Star is an interesting one too. I've read comments about its greenside spin, which is sort of included in the marketing piece. I've never seen anything from it to say it's different than other similar balls though. There may be minor differences that I've not been able to pick up on. Nothing against the ball either. It does what it's designed to do just fine.


I'll say that I still think the Z-Star and the Hex Black were the two spinniest balls I played this year, but that goes back to what Jake said. Maybe I just had a tight wedge game at that time or maybe the conditions were there for those few shots I tend to recall most often.

 

[JRod]

Q-Star is an interesting one too. I've read comments about its greenside spin, which is sort of included in the marketing piece. I've never seen anything from it to say it's different than other similar balls though. There may be minor differences that I've not been able to pick up on. Nothing against the ball either. It does what it's designed to do just fine.


I'll say that I still think the Z-Star and the Hex Black were the two spinniest balls I played this year, but that goes back to what Jake said. Maybe I just had a tight wedge game at that time or maybe the conditions were there for those few shots I tend to recall most often.

See I don't know man. I have spun the hex blacks back so ridiculously far I don't know what to think. Ask rhino and bulldog it was insane. I put a lot of spin on my wedge shots but those things were just ridiculous.

 

[TRyan]

Ryan,

I have seen a lot from people about how the Q-Star spins a lot, backs up 2-3 feet, etc. I just dont see that. I see some greenside control with it. A touch of rollout, and on full shots I can stop it without hardly any. I like the ball off my irons and driver, and I have gotten used to how it plays around the green.

I really like the Hex Black, but just can't afford them TBH

 

[Hawk]

See I don't know man. I have spun the hex blacks back so ridiculously far I don't know what to think. Ask rhino and bulldog it was insane. I put a lot of spin on my wedge shots but those things were just ridiculous.

That's sort of where I am. That ball did things I hadn't seen before from my game. It's just interesting to me. Why/how would it be so different?

 

[Chunkylover77]

I really have no clue about golf ball spin. I can have an off day with the driver, maybe putting some sidespin on it with an awful swing, and that ball will forever be known as a ball that spins too much for my driver

 

[Griff]

The number one thing that dictates back spin results for me is the condition of the golf course. That's far more variable than any ball for my game. I basically play the b330 RX and e6, 2 different balls for sure. This time of year, cool and damp, the e6 is a no brainer. It'll spin plenty around the green while giving me less side spin off the tee and approaches. The b330 rx is no good for me if its sloppy and damp. Stops too short on the green and is more likely to check on the FW. Hot and dry weather the b330 RX is my go to ball. The e6 can be a runaway train on hard greens.

Point is, no matter what ball I use the conditions dictate what my ball will do. I don't play in the same conditions all the time. Same course on back to back days can play very differently based on time of day, weather, watered greens, mowed in AM, etc.

 

[jmatt]

Really, I only notice spin off the driver, and that's anecdotal - how many times do I see a enormous banana that day. For approaches, I'm just too inconsistent to tell if one ball sits or rolls a bit more or less. Green conditions are going to do a TON more to my approaches than anything I'm doing. Launch and decent angles are a close second, and even there I'm hard pressed to see a difference.

Short version - I find a lot of Pro-Vs and lose them quickly. I find far fewer E6s, but they hang around longer. Short chips / pitches, the urethane balls seem to roll out less, but nothing spectacular.

 

[War Eagle]

Ive always found it interesting about ball spin and what people see. Specifically when people say that one ball has more "side spin" than another. When looking at properties like that, my first instinct is to look at swing and the technique, and I believe that spin or lack there of, is generated there, rather than a ball having more/less spin properties.

 

[Mr. Satchmo]

I think the 330 RX is a good example here just based on some comments I've read in the past. It's got a firmer cover than some other Tour balls, but I've stopped it dead with good contact. It may not have quite as many RPM's, but still performs like I'd expect a Tour ball to with the right technique.

when I make solid contact with my short irons or wedges into the green, I tend to see similar results regardless of what ball I use, I tend to see a ball that hits hard and stops pretty close to the point of where it hit the green, although I've seen harder balls that I don't compress easily roll out a bit more, I can stop the hex black, Pentas, and Prov1s dead on the green but I think that depends more on my technique and my solid contact if that makes any sense.

 

[wadesworld]

Ive always found it interesting about ball spin and what people see. Specifically when people say that one ball has more "side spin" than another. When looking at properties like that, my first instinct is to look at swing and the technique, and I believe that spin or lack there of, is generated there, rather than a ball having more/less spin properties.

Agreed, but in theory if you hit two shots exactly the same with the exact same swing flaw in place, the ball designed with less side spin will see a less severe effect. Could I prove it? Heck no.

 

[wadesworld]

The number one thing that dictates back spin results for me is the condition of the golf course. That's far more variable than any ball for my game. I basically play the b330 RX and e6, 2 different balls for sure. This time of year, cool and damp, the e6 is a no brainer. It'll spin plenty around the green while giving me less side spin off the tee and approaches. The b330 rx is no good for me if its sloppy and damp. Stops too short on the green and is more likely to check on the FW. Hot and dry weather the b330 RX is my go to ball. The e6 can be a runaway train on hard greens.

Point is, no matter what ball I use the conditions dictate what my ball will do. I don't play in the same conditions all the time. Same course on back to back days can play very differently based on time of day, weather, watered greens, mowed in AM, etc.

I like this line of thinking.

 

[tdinbr]

I've never been a "spin it back" consistently (if at all) type of player but the one ball I have been able to spin back is the Z-Star. I never try to do it on purpose, sometimes it will, sometimes it won't, and I know this is due to how I am striking the ball that day.
That being said, I prefer playing the Z-Star. Something about that ball just feels right to me. The sound, the feel off of the club from driver to putter, and the results I get from it are all positive for me. I have played almost eveything, from the Laddie on up to the Pro V1x, and the Z-Star just sets my mind at ease when I use it, particularly the yellow model. Just feels right and that's half the battle....

 

[Mr. Satchmo]

I've never been a "spin it back" consistently (if at all) type of player but the one ball I have been able to spin back is the Z-Star. I never try to do it on purpose, sometimes it will, sometimes it won't, and I know this is due to how I am striking the ball that day.
That being said, I prefer playing the Z-Star. Something about that ball just feels right to me. The sound, the feel off of the club from driver to putter, and the results I get from it are all positive for me. I have played almost eveything, from the Laddie on up to the Pro V1x, and the Z-Star just sets my mind at ease when I use it, particularly the yellow model. Just feels right and that's half the battle....

I've only spun it back once, but then again the green was a bit sloping downward, so that probably helped with the spinning lol. I hit prov1 on a par 3 and hit the green pretty hard with my PW, it spun back quite a bit.