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Hooker - Going back to my roots

v.man said:
Really??? Did you have them bent before to promote a fade?
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Yep. I spent the entire year trying to revamp my swing and strictly going with a fade. I also had my irons bent 2 degrees flat which did not help matters, when trying to go back to my right to left shot. It was my worst ball striking year since I started playing the game. It's funny though, I did shoot my tournament PB with a 73 this year, however it was a fluke. It was one of those in the zone moments for me and the rest of the year was painful.
 
I fight a hook as well and sympathize completely. Especially since Hogans secret enabled him to trash the hook, play a fade as become so successful.

Until recently I couldn't hit a fade or slice at all. I was baby draw or a hook at was so long and off target it was embarrassing. Still fight that hook. Worse, it comes up on me late in rounds and can ruin a good finish, or exacerbate a bad one.

Now that I have learned a fade I do play one off the tee ... Or when I need to call on the shot when I've shorts used myself, but that's it. Every other full shot I'm playing a baby draw, and trying to make my miss a push, rather than a hook.

I think it's the best compromise for me. A fade off the tee, when wild, is better than a snap hook for me. I lose a lot of distance off the tee, but am not in as much trouble and it's directly contributed to a huge decrease in my scores.

That decrease has got me wondering if I should play a fade more often, or always, but I'm waffling. I think the posts ive read here have talked me out of it. I like being able to shape a ball either way, but I don't want to psych myself out too much.

When I was picking up my new irons I hit a bunch into the screen at GolfTown to see what the difference was between them and my old clubs. After, I hit another sample of shots hitting a cut. I thought I was fading it nicely, and even though the shots were 10-15 yds less (with an 8iron), I was happy with the consistency.

I asked if that yardage drop is typical and the fitter guy at the shop says "not that much" ... But you're barely swinging as hard with those fade shots, right? In my mind I thought I was going after them with everything I had and he said 'no way, you were confidently going after the draw buy babying the fade'.

I guess, like you said OG, it's a confidence thing. Maybe I'll stick to workin on that draw. It's a little harder to call up with the new RBZs but thats probably just me getting used to them.
 
Seamus MacDuff said:
I fight a hook as well and sympathize completely. Especially since Hogans secret enabled him to trash the hook, play a fade as become so successful.

Until recently I couldn't hit a fade or slice at all. I was baby draw or a hook at was so long and off target it was embarrassing. Still fight that hook. Worse, it comes up on me late in rounds and can ruin a good finish, or exacerbate a bad one.

Now that I have learned a fade I do play one off the tee ... Or when I need to call on the shot when I've shorts used myself, but that's it. Every other full shot I'm playing a baby draw, and trying to make my miss a push, rather than a hook.

I think it's the best compromise for me. A fade off the tee, when wild, is better than a snap hook for me. I lose a lot of distance off the tee, but am not in as much trouble and it's directly contributed to a huge decrease in my scores.

That decrease has got me wondering if I should play a fade more often, or always, but I'm waffling. I think the posts ive read here have talked me out of it. I like being able to shape a ball either way, but I don't want to psych myself out too much.

When I was picking up my new irons I hit a bunch into the screen at GolfTown to see what the difference was between them and my old clubs. After, I hit another sample of shots hitting a cut. I thought I was fading it nicely, and even though the shots were 10-15 yds less (with an 8iron), I was happy with the consistency.

I asked if that yardage drop is typical and the fitter guy at the shop says "not that much" ... But you're barely swinging as hard with those fade shots, right? In my mind I thought I was going after them with everything I had and he said 'no way, you were confidently going after the draw buy babying the fade'.

I guess, like you said OG, it's a confidence thing. Maybe I'll stick to workin on that draw. It's a little harder to call up with the new RBZs but thats probably just me getting used to them.
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Hmmmm interesting comment. So you are having a harder time drawing the RBZ irons?
 
Ole Gray said:
Hmmmm interesting comment. So you are having a harder time drawing the RBZ irons?
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I'm having a harder time hitting my ol reliable baby draw that I like and that you mention. They either go straight (so it looks like a push ... and surprises me everytime it happens) or I hook them. I'm still looking for that middle draw shot.

BUT ... In only my 2nd round playing them I tied my PB. So, Im feeling like the mistakes arent hurting me and I'll only get better with them. Obviously a lot of that was chipping and putting (2 chip ins 26 putts) but, i really like these S300 shafts a lot better and find the distances more consistent than the burners. No wildly long shots out of nowhere.
 
Just an addendum to my post above ... I'm at the range now testing this and my comments above really only apply to the longer irons. The five in particular, but to a lesser extent the 6 and 7 and maybe 8. I can draw the other ones perfectly, and ... honestly, straight is a good miss for a hooker like me.
 
Seamus MacDuff said:
I'm having a harder time hitting my ol reliable baby draw that I like and that you mention. They either go straight (so it looks like a push ... and surprises me everytime it happens) or I hook them. I'm still looking for that middle draw shot.

BUT ... In only my 2nd round playing them I tied my PB. So, Im feeling like the mistakes arent hurting me and I'll only get better with them. Obviously a lot of that was chipping and putting (2 chip ins 26 putts) but, i really like these S300 shafts a lot better and find the distances more consistent than the burners. No wildly long shots out of nowhere.
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Sounds like the RBZ's are going to be the ticket for ya :thumb:. I was hitting some sweet little draws with them until I decided to tinker with what was natural to me and then went a step further and messed with the lie on them.

Confidence & positive mental imaging are 90 percent of the game IMO. When you don't have a go to shot that you can depend on, it's a thin layer of ice you're walking on. I walked on that thin stuff all of 2012 and truthfully, I'm sick of standing on the first tee and trying to decide what type of shot I'm going with. In the first place, I was not born with enough talent to carry two swings in my repertoire. When I was having a bad day and the draw turned into a hook, so be it. At least I know my timing/tempo got off rhythm and I know how to fix that. When I'm playing out of my comfort zone and into the twilight zone and I don't even have a clue how to put a band aid on it, that is when the shat hits the fan. One thing that I learned from 2012 is, I will go to my grave a hooker :D
 
I think you're right. I read what you said and tinkered around a bit and just had a great range session with them. Really good. Im starting to fall for these irons in a big way. That 5iron is just to different from the rest though.

Either way, I'll join you in the hooker-for-life clan. And, I think you'll have it back in no time. Playing a draw is a great natural shot and as you get older youd probably go back to it eventually just for the extra distance.

Look forward to hearing how it goes. Maybe the other thing youll have from this year is a fade or slice you can play when in trouble?
 
Seamus MacDuff said:
I think you're right. I read what you said and tinkered around a bit and just had a great range session with them. Really good. Im starting to fall for these irons in a big way. That 5iron is just to different from the rest though.

Either way, I'll join you in the hooker-for-life clan. And, I think you'll have it back in no time. Playing a draw is a great natural shot and as you get older youd probably go back to it eventually just for the extra distance.

Look forward to hearing how it goes. Maybe the other thing youll have from this year is a fade or slice you can play when in trouble?
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Good for you fellow hooker :D! Sounds like the time on the range confirmed your natural tendencies.

Now back when I was a hooker from the hood, my fade was a straight shot :bulgy-eyes:. If I ever hit a cut it was from bouncing off a tree to the right. haha Seriously I definitely will have more skill with with a cut shot after this year, than I ever had in my golfing life. Well except for when I first started hitting a ball, I might have hit a slice on the first two shots :act-up:
 
Today I begin my transformation back to where I was a year ago. I tried to turn the page back by myself with no luck so I'm going with my new head pro for some help. This is the beginning of a new but old transition to my comfort zone, which happens to be a right to left golf shot. I have no doubt, that with both the lessons and maybe some equipment modification, this experiment will be successful. Heck the old saying, "the only way now is up", applies to my golf game. Maybe Santa will bring me a new golf game for 2013! :blob: I will post my journey starting today, on how this major tweak back to the old days pans out. I'm excited and it's "Go time"!!!
 
really good stuff OG.... i had a LONG talk with my instructor yesterday while playing with him about your journey and how much me changing my swing this off season really does scare me. i'm still really torn on what i want to do but i do know i will continue to work on my short game cause my lesson yesterday paid dividends. i think i want to work on making me a little more consistent and fixing some things but not going through with a complete change just yet especially with the Morgan Cup this year. Guess i still have some time to decide. but i'll be following your progress. Good Luck Bud!
 
Buckjob said:
really good stuff OG.... i had a LONG talk with my instructor yesterday while playing with him about your journey and how much me changing my swing this off season really does scare me. i'm still really torn on what i want to do but i do know i will continue to work on my short game cause my lesson yesterday paid dividends. i think i want to work on making me a little more consistent and fixing some things but not going through with a complete change just yet especially with the Morgan Cup this year. Guess i still have some time to decide. but i'll be following your progress. Good Luck Bud!
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Thanks BJ and as long as you're consistent you should be fine. I know a big change prior to your Morgan Cup season would be a scary ride for sure. Kind of like riding the biggest roller coast on the planet, standing up and yelling yo momma, to the coaster operator :bulgy-eyes:
 
Good luck today, Gray!
 
I went to my lesson today to get back to my comfort zone. I got that and much more than I had expected. My coach watched me hit balls for a couple of minutes and instantly told me what was causing my inconsistency and how to fix it. Getting the ball moving from right to left was the easy part. My take away was all out of whack causing the face of the club to be extremely open at the ball/club impact position. The face of my club was actually pointing up to the sky on the back swing. At impact position my timing had to be perfect to make a solid strike.

Another evil that came from the incorrect takeaway, was a lunging effort on the downswing, which caused my left shoulder to come up and out of the proper position. To fix this he had me take the club not outside but beside my right pocket, then lift it up while turning my shoulders. I was also told to not squat so much in my stance. He wanted me to keep my left shoulder from dipping on the backswing to moving down on the forward swing. Another thing he noticed was how much I was crouching down in my setup and he wanted me to stand up a bit more during address.

He said it is very likely that my upcoming fitting will be very interesting. He stressed how important it was to have the sole of the club setting flat on the ground. With the length and lie of the clubs I have now, it narrows the clubface for me a substantial amount which decreases my chances of a solid strike. He is thinking I may need an inch added to the length of my irons. He does not do the fitting as another guy in Athens will do an intense two hour fitting to determine the proper fit.

So my homework for now is to not dip my left shoulder on my takeaway, lift my hands up, and turn down (drop in the slot) and through the ball on the downswing. He also stressed to keep my head behind the ball and to feel the weight on the inside of my right leg when I made my turn. He showed me how the weight stayed on the left leg in my old swing which in turn caused the shoulder to dip. We talked about arm, & shaft angles, wrist cock which I did not have any at all, and much more today. He said to not try and build Rome in one day but one block at a time. Him and I are going to get along just fine!
 
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well good news I'm glad he gave you lots of great advice, and I hope you can get your game back to where you want it.

Ole Gray said:
I went to my lesson today to get back to my comfort zone. I got that and much more than I had expected. My coach watched me hit balls for a couple of minutes and instantly told me what was causing my inconsistency and how to fix it. Getting the ball moving from right to left was the easy part. My take away was all out of whack causing the face of the club to be extremely open at the ball/club impact position. The face of my club was actually pointing up to the sky on the back swing. At impact position my timing had to be perfect to make a solid strike. Another evil that came from the incorrect takeaway, was a lunging effort on the downswing, which caused my left shoulder to come up and out of the proper position. To fix this he had me take the club not outside but beside my right pocket, then lift it up while turning my shoulders. I was also told to not squat so much in my stance. He wanted me to keep my left shoulder from dipping on the backswing to moving down on the forward swing. Another thing he noticed was how much I was crouching down in my setup and he wanted me to stand up a bit more during address. He said it is very likely that my upcoming fitting will be very interesting. He stressed how important it was to have the sole of the club setting flat on the ground. With the length and lie of the clubs I have now, it narrows the clubface for me a substantial amount which decreases my chances of a solid strike. He is thinking I may need an inch added to the length of my irons. He does not do the fitting as another guy in Athens will do an intense two hour fitting to determine the proper fit. So my homework for now is to not dip my left shoulder on my takeaway, lift my hands up, and turn down (drop in the slot) and through the ball on the downswing. He also stressed to keep my head behind the ball and to feel the weight on the inside of my right leg when I made my turn. He showed me how the weight stayed on the left leg in my old swing which in turn caused the shoulder to dip. We talked about arm, & shaft angles, wrist cock which I did not have any at all, and much more today. He said to not try and build Rome in one day but one block at a time. Him and I are going to get along just fine!
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Good News there Bill, How did your round after the lesson go ?
 
Intimadator2007 said:
Good News there Bill, How did your round after the lesson go ?
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Sorry buddy for the late answer however I've been hugging the couch like a rabbit in a carrot patch :hungry:. I had about three naps and when I finally got to stirring, KB was on the laptop. I was too stiff and sore to walk back to the back bedroom and hop on the desktop :D. Anyways no, I did not play well however I did hit quite a few well struck shots. I was focusing so hard on what I was just taught that scoring was just not my priority. It would have been nice to throw up a cute little round in the 70's but not to be today. I can tell ya one thing, I have never been happier shooting a 94. I hit some really nice shots that rung a bell in this big old head of mine. Just saying if I stay on this train track, I might just get to the station. I have no doubt we are on to something here :thumb:
 
This has been an exciting day for you for sure buddy, I like reading that your new instructor sees so many things so quickly but still lets you know that it is a marathon not a sprint to get where you are now heading. Keep us posted on your progress.
 
Coach sounds good Billy.

That backswing is very important..I had same exact problem. Easiest to break the backswing down in two thoughts...hands come in towards right pocket then straight up over the right shoulder. The hand path in the backswing is almost straight up towards pluto. Its crazy. I spent so much time swinging way behind me. Hopefully this can save you some time.




I know ur not a tiger fan but look at that hand path...straight up a rope. It doesn't have to be that steep but I've been hitting it 2000% better since I've learned to do this.

But really work on that backswing first and foremost. Don't move on until you have it...you can still play...but your only swing thought should be "in and up". Its gonna feel ass backwards but you'll be hitting some high bombs in no time.

IN and UP (wanna feel like your hands are high above your right shoulder)

IN and UP....and bust it.
 
MarcH said:
Coach sounds good Billy.

That backswing is very important..I had same exact problem. Easiest to break the backswing down in two thoughts...hands come in towards right pocket then straight up over the right shoulder. The hand path in the backswing is almost straight up towards pluto. Its crazy. I spent so much time swinging way behind me. Hopefully this can save you some time.


I know ur not a tiger fan but look at that hand path...straight up a rope. It doesn't have to be that steep but I've been hitting it 2000% better since I've learned to do this.

But really work on that backswing first and foremost. Don't move on until you have it...you can still play...but your only swing thought should be "in and up". Its gonna feel ass backwards but you'll be hitting some high bombs in no time.

IN and UP (wanna feel like your hands are high above your right shoulder)

IN and UP....and bust it.
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This ^^^^^^^^^^^ is exactly one of his terms for me to focus on! Hands in towards right pocket and up. Dam it boy you hit the nail on the head:blob:. I could not remember that last night as he said so many things but he did stress this drill for me and said it's a must.
 
Marc -- This also reminded me of one more thing he said. While watching me take the club back, he said I was taking it too much on a straight line causing me to fall out on my toes thus losing balance. I had felt many times that I was about to fall on my head from falling forward and did not realize it was from the takeaway. This improved move will have my weight transferring more back on the inside of my right leg. Much better balance and power. The great thing about opening a thread like this is you can look back over it several times and reinforce the lessons learned. I got a long way to go but the little red train is headed up the mountain :D

Hey buddy, I miss that KellyBo and I are not coming out your way for Christmas again this year. That was a ton of fun last year :thumb:
 
Great to see that things are getting off to a good start OG.
I think it's really important to keep in mind the "rome wasn't built in a day". I know that's something I have to constantly tell myself too.
 
Ole Gray said:
Marc -- This also reminded me of one more thing he said. While watching me take the club back, he said I was taking it too much on a straight line causing me to fall out on my toes thus losing balance. I had felt many times that I was about to fall on my head from falling forward and did not realize it was from the takeaway. This improved move will have my weight transferring more back on the inside of my right leg. Much better balance and power. The great thing about opening a thread like this is you can look back over it several times and reinforce the lessons learned. I got a long way to go but the little red train is headed up the mountain :D

Hey buddy, I miss that KellyBo and I are not coming out your way for Christmas again this year. That was a ton of fun last year :thumb:
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IN and UP! Tattoo it on your forehead. lol

I'll be there on the 28th. Hope to get out at least once at the country club! RIP goat track
 
MarcH said:
IN and UP! Tattoo it on your forehead. lol

I'll be there on the 28th. Hope to get out at least once at the country club! RIP goat track
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haha RIP goat track :D. Man I have some good memories from that old track. I think you will be pleasantly surprised at the new goat track up here :thumb:

I went out today and got me a big old tatoo on my right arm that said IN & UP :golf2:jk
 
I played golf with KellyBo today and she made me feel good. She told me it was cool to see how much better I'm striking the ball now. I think she is impressed with our new club pro and what he has done for me at this point. I now have a dream of getting this wagon hooked up to the right mule :thumb:
 
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Awesome! Keep up the great work

Ole Gray said:
I played golf with KellyBo today and she made me feel good. She told me it was cool to see how much better I am striking the ball now. I think she is impressed with our new club pro and what he has done for me at this point. I now have a dream of getting this wagon hooked up to the right mule :thumb:
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