Correct, sadly.
How Good is Ohtani?
Correct, sadly.
The Angels issue with Pujols is they made his contract too long. The last 3+ yrs were awful. They then went and signed Rendon and he proceeded to get hurt. They can't really sign Ohtani and have the Trout and Rendon contract hanging there. They have a bad farm system so they have no controllable cheap superstars coming. It is a really bad situation for them. Great for teams in their division.
PVA_Golf 93
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In addition, people keep talking about his upcoming contract like he's going to be as good as he is on both sides of the ball his whole career. In no way, shape or form and I doubting or knocking his talent. I love watching him and think he is the most talented player in the game right now, and what he is doing is magical. But, if a team shells out a 700 million, 10 year contract, do ya really think by say even year 5, he's still putting out the production on both sides of the ball like he is today? History as my reference, I just cannot see it.
I just don't think a lot of people see this, and the network pundits don't really talk about it (MLB probably fire them if they did so)
so much of sports coverage and conversation (media and fans both) has become focused on the transaction more than the action.
i don't think Ohtani can cut an outside deal with a team prior to a trade to that team, that's tampering.
if the Angels were in on it as part of the trade, ie., sign and trade, it can take place. but in that case the compensation is much, much higher.
owners just can't help themselves.
Moreno will stick with his dumb approach.
someone else will give Ohtani a 10-year contract.
meanwhile...
i don't think Ohtani can cut an outside deal with a team prior to a trade to that team, that's tampering.
if the Angels were in on it as part of the trade, ie., sign and trade, it can take place. but in that case the compensation is much, much higher.
owners just can't help themselves.
Moreno will stick with his dumb approach.
someone else will give Ohtani a 10-year contract.
meanwhile...
You say history as your reference but we have literally never seen this. The comparisons to Babe Ruth are because he was so good as a P or hitter as well. But Babe didn't really do both at same time. If you look up Babe's numbers when he was a really good P he only had 20 HR's combined in those years.
Ohtani is basically the best guy on most HS teams but he is doing it at the highest level possible and has now for a few years. To me he is a Unicorn.
PVA_Golf 93
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I agree with everything you said above. But my "history as my reference" comment was talking about guys getting paid these massive contracts, and rarely reaching the levels of production before they signed them, whether it be due to injury or age. Obviously players do slowly decline as they age, and I'm truly hoping he's the exception to this because I love seeing the level he plays at, I'm just warning of a cautious approach.
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This is so true. And doing it in this era of metrics is insane.
I don't disagree with any of this - but without a salary cap these things just really don't matter. Will the Dodgers (or whomever gets him) get THIS level of production for the entire length of the contract? Unlikely, but they are paying for the years he will be productive. It is just the cost of doing business in Major League Baseball
Ahh... I misunderstood it. My bad.. thanks for clarifying. I agree on the contract part. I am also a diehard Dodgers fan and hope we get him.
Colin Cowherd of all people had a great point years ago when the Angels signed Pujols for 10yrs $200mil (crazy at the time). He said in terms of production you have to look at it like 5 yrs $40M per.
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Yup. Whoever signs him is willing to make a run for 5 years and suck for 5 to eat the contract. Such a flawed league but that isn’t Ohtani’s fault who is arguably the best to ever play.
What Babe did was transcendent because of the time — he was hitting more home runs than entire teams. Almost mythical.
The game in 2023 is undoubtedly the most competitive it’s ever been from a league-wide standpoint. Such a higher % of pitchers routinely throw in the upper 90s, guys are touching 103 or 104, or 101 with a ton of movement. Hitters have more video and data than ever.
That Ohtani is:
*an elite pitcher
*an elite hitter
*with nearly elite sprint speed
during the most competitive era in the game’s history is just insane.
Put it another way: Mike Trout is almost unquestionably the best player of the last 10 years as a whole (somehow, he’s been underrated by some).
And right now, he isn’t even close to as valuable as Ohtani.
That’s all to just repeat that yeah, unicorn is the right term.
PVA_Golf 93
Active member
All good! I see why you thought I meant it the other way. As a Braves fan, I hope ya don't since we will have to get past ya in future Octobers!!
All jokes aside, I think LAD is the most likely place for him to go if he leaves LAA. And I also think he brings a TON of Angel fans to the Dodgers if he does
Living in California (and basically LA and OC for most of it) you won't see very many actual fans leave the Angels and become Dodger fans just for Ohtani.All good! I see why you thought I meant it the other way. As a Braves fan, I hope ya don't since we will have to get past ya in future Octobers!!
All jokes aside, I think LAD is the most likely place for him to go if he leaves LAA. And I also think he brings a TON of Angel fans to the Dodgers if he does
PVA_Golf 93
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I think your keyword there is "actual". You know well the bandwagoners will make the jump! But for someone like Ohtani, I can't blame people for being fans of him and wanting to follow where he goes!
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- #117
Fun stat
Players with 40 HRs and 10 wins as a pitcher in a season?
The list is one.
Players with 40 HRs and 10 wins as a pitcher in a season?
The list is one.
And now they really regret not trading him.
Oof, total bummer for him.
Oof, total bummer for him.
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Saw that this morning…will be curious to see how bad it really is.
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They are getting a second opinion and he has had some minor stuff the last couple of weeks including blister and fatigue. Right now it doesn’t appear he will pitch, but we won’t know the extent until later on what he can bring.
As a fan of baseball in general.. this sucks.
We’ll have to wait to learn the extent of the injury. Leaves us with the questions of when he can come back as a hitter and when he can come back as a pitcher.
I honestly don’t think he plays again this season. The Angels aren’t going to the playoffs and there are 500 or so million reasons not to aggravate the elbow injury even if only as a DH.
He's played in game 2 of the double header as a hitter. Messaging is that he won't pitch this year. Big question for pitching is whether or not he needs surgery.
PVA_Golf 93
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I really hope its nothing major for him. He is awesome for this game