It’s time to go Rogue, or perhaps as Callaway is phrasing it, “Think Speed. Go Rogue.”
After a release cycle away, where Callaway introduced the Mavrik lineup, Rogue is back, but if you are thinking it’s just another “off year release” that isn’t Epic, you might want to reassess that.
Callaway is pulling no punches here, and though the Rogue line may have a slightly different target in some respects than Epic, this is still them bringing all of their innovations to the table alongside some new ones.
What better place to start than drivers, so let’s get into it!
While the Rogue name is back, there is no denying a lot has changed. Where metalwoods are concerned, the name of the game is stability, and Callaway is utilizing its most extreme weighting technology combined with every other tech which they have pioneered and continue to evolve.
Foremost, every single club in the new Rogue lineup has a unique A.I. face which now takes even more parameters into consideration like speed, launch, and spin robustness through a new optimization formula which means an even more refined face. Make no mistake, Callaway is not at all exaggerating when they say no one is doing club design like they are, and no one is using A.I. like they are.
These drivers have the most extreme weighting tech the company has ever used in a driver, they are using a “Tungsten Speed Cartridge” which uses up to 26g of MIM’d Tungsten, and folks that is a lot of tungsten. This is placed at the very extreme edge of the driver in order to increase speed on off center hits through “ball speed robustness”, which is fancy for minimizing the loss when you miss. Of course, this also helps with making the head more resistant to twisting.
Each driver is also using the new “Speed Tuned Jailbreak Speedframe” which is like what was used in Epic, except more slender with the same balance and stiffness, though some priority is given to further stiffening the lower part of the head.
Finally, the shaping here is a departure from the Cyclone shaping of the Mavrik release, that has gone in favor of a more rearward CG through the use of a “low tail” which looks pretty familiar to be honest, but this does follow the current trend, so it makes a lot of sense to see. It doesn’t mean Cyclone was wrong, this is just a different way to make things happen. This is part of the unibody frame construction that takes from F1 in the notion of making as much of the head one piece as possible while keeping it smooth and thin. It is finished out in all the Rogue drivers with Triaxial Carbon on both the crown and sole.
Even bolder than the tech perhaps, is that Callaway is bringing four different drivers to the Rogue ST MAX lineup. Yes, four.
Callaway Rogue ST MAX D Driver
This one is the most draw biased of the four drivers, it is the club for those who tend to struggle with a slice and need as much shot shape correction as they can get. This naturally has a draw weighted CG and a closed face orientation with the largest footprint to provide the forgiveness, elevation, and directional correction that golfers need without excessive spin.
The MAX D comes in three lofts (9°, 10.5°, 12°) and utilizes the OptiFit adapter. All three heads are also available in RH and LH.
Rogue ST Max Driver Rogue ST Max Driver
Callaway Rogue ST MAX Driver
This is the “sweetspot” driver of the lineup which will fit the largest number of golfers in the segment. It does have a slight draw bias because, believe it or not, that is what most of us need, and this offers the best combination of forgiveness and distance. The Rogue ST Max has the highest MOI of the four models and is somewhat larger but designed to still fit the eye of even the most discerning golfers.
The MAX has three base loft options (9°, 10.5°, 12°) with each using the OptiFit adapter and being available in both RH and LH.
Rogue ST Max LS Driver Rogue ST Max LS Driver
Callaway Rogue ST MAX LS Driver
Ah yes, the Rogue which is aimed at the slightly better player, the golfer which wants to see the ball go right and left at times and can use a more neutral overall bias to do just that. The MAX LS maintains a very high overall MOI thanks to the Tungsten Speed Cartridge but also keeps a lower launch angle and spin rate than the MAX.
The MAX LS also uses the Callaway OptiFit adapter in two loft options (9° and 10.5°) which also are available in both RH and LH.
Rogue ST Max Triple Diamond LS Driver Rogue ST Max Triple Diamond LS Driver
Callaway Rogue ST Triple Diamond LS
Yes, for those who clamor with every single Callaway metalwood release, for this driver release, the Triple Diamond is a regular part of the lineup. Well, as regular as it can be. The Triple Diamond is a 450cc head making it the smallest of the four and has the lowest spin profile with the most neutral to fade bias of the four options. While it still offers all the design bells and whistles of the others, there is no doubt the Triple Diamond is for the smallest segment.
Availability here is in two lofts (9° and 10.5°) with the OptiFit adapter and in both RH an LH.
While it will come as no surprise, Callaway, through their internal and external testing, believes they have created four drivers that will each lead their specific segment in performance. A bold take, absolutely, but the crew at Callaway have never been short of confidence, which they typically back up well.
The Details
Standard shaft options are as follows:
- Lightweight/Womens – Project X Cypher Black (40g, 50g)
- Mid Offering – Mitsubishi Tensei AV Blue (50g, 60g, 70g)
- Low Offering – Mitsubishi Tensei AV White (60g, 70g, 80g)
The Rogue ST drivers will be priced at $549.99 and hit retail on 2/18/22. Be sure to keep a keen eye on the THP Community as we will have a lot of feedback beginning today as 12 forum members already have these in hand!
Love the matte black look of these. These seem to be a complimentary line to the Epix Speed/Max line which is nice – 2 great segments for golfers.
[QUOTE=”Nappy, post: 10339694, member: 2407″]
I don’t. This was the area where I failed during the fitting – I didn’t take any pictures of the Trackman results and I’m kicking myself daily for that. This is why I’m looking forward to getting this back on a launch monitor so I can have some more data to share. I know my swing has been over the top lately, I have an issue dropping my elbow on the downswing.
[/QUOTE]
Same! I wish I had numbers and actually plan to get to a simulator once the rest of the equipment comes in. No ragrets though!
This is the first Callaway driver in several years that I absolutely love the look of. Going back to the matte crown is such a huge plus in my opinion. It’s great seeing how well this has performed for the Grandaddy guys so far and will be fun to follow along with this year.
For me personally that Triple Diamond LS could be a perfect fit. I really wish they had an adjustable weight but considering it if fade biased it might fit me really well.
These look really really good. If I didn’t just get fit into (and bought a used example of) a Max LS this might be on my radar…but I’m not that much of a club ho! I will definitely be interested to hit the Rogue LS just for scientific purposes though… :p
It’s very interesting to me – and IMO, speaks volumes to the level of forgiveness on offer here – that a pretty large portion of the Grandaddy folks got fitted into the ???. You would definitely expect to see a lot more folks on the other side of the bell curve. I guess we do have a better than the average golfer distribution going on this forum though, so there’s already some better-golfer skew in play here.
Great feedback from all the GD team so far! These are firmly on my radar for the 2022 season. Gonna [I]try[/I] to stick with my Mav until I get a good swing going in the spring and then go find somewhere to hit these and get an idea. Loving the matte crown and all the options. Could this be the driver that unseats my Mavrik? We’re definitely going to find out this year.
[QUOTE=”DNice26, post: 10339445, member: 45706″]
Hope they release the Standard Triple diamond head. Not the triple D LS.
I like the fade bias, but I want the spin.
[/QUOTE]
You could always change balls and add in a couple hundred RPM back into it.
[QUOTE=”Muchmore18, post: 10339691, member: 56094″]
[USER=55541]@Tevenor[/USER] has quite a few numbers on his write up on page 4
[/QUOTE]
Yes I do. And will be getting more soon. 🙂 Always fiddling and tinkering.
[QUOTE=”Tevenor, post: 10339980, member: 55541″]
You could always change balls and add in a couple hundred RPM back into it.
[/QUOTE]
I usually play a spinny ball for that reason. But yeah, that and the right shaft of course.
I will def try out the LS model and see if it can work for me! Love the matt head.
This driver looks incredible. Love the simplicity of the black and gold. Really interested in the Max D as someone who struggles with coming over the top and slicing.
Great recaps on these from the GD crew!
I need a 150% trade in….
[QUOTE=”Jman, post: 10340133, member: 1579″]
I need a 150% trade in….
[/QUOTE]
It’s happened before
Oh boy. I’m glad I didn’t go for last year’s Epic series because I’m afraid that I might be regretting it now. I’m not sold on the matte finish, but I’m not going to judge it until I have the chance to see it in person. I love my ’20 Rogue, and I’ve never bought a driver during it’s current release cycle, but this could be the one that changes all of that.
I always talk about drivers and my playing partners always tell me I need a new driver when I’m only outdriving them by 25 yards, so maybe I take the advice?
I’m not going to lie – I can easily see this driver being in my bag for the 22 golf season. Now I just need to get a fitting scheduled.
Still….Max LS…or diamondsssssssss
[QUOTE=”Junkyard, post: 10340155, member: 12544″]
Oh boy. I’m glad I didn’t go for last year’s Epic series because I’m afraid that I might be regretting it now. I’m not sold on the matte finish, but I’m not going to judge it until I have the chance to see it in person. I love my ’20 Rogue, and I’ve never bought a driver during it’s current release cycle, but this could be the one that changes all of that.
I always talk about drivers and my playing partners always tell me I need a new driver when I’m only outdriving them by 25 yards, so maybe I take the advice?
I’m not going to lie – I can easily see this driver being in my bag for the 22 golf season. Now I just need to get a fitting scheduled.
[/QUOTE]
You won’t regret it! As far as the matte finish on top this is by far the nicest one I have come across. It is done so nicely that it doesn’t look as if it was painted flat black with spray paint like many other manufacturers had done in the past. It looks so great to the eye in the setup.[ATTACH type=”full”]9057338[/ATTACH]
All of the reviews and feedback, from [USER=1579]@Jman[/USER] to the Grandaddy participants, have been super good. Thanks. I have a question and it is not intended to be a troll.
Callaway has promoted its use of a super computer for several years now. The supercomputer uses artificial intelligence to run millions of permutations to optimize the face technology. I understand this concept.
Here is where I am stuck. If the supercomputer undertook this in depth analysis and optimization, how could anything be improved upon the first round of optimization, absent some new material that could be thrown into the equation. It would seem almost impossible to find engineering improvement after the first year’s use of the supercomputer.
What am I missing?
[QUOTE=”Tenputt, post: 10340177, member: 42964″]
All of the reviews and feedback, from [USER=1579]@Jman[/USER] to the Grandaddy participants, have been, I have a question and it is not intended to be a troll.
Callaway has promoted its use of a super computer for several years now. The supercomputer uses artificial intelligence to run millions of permutations to optimize the face technology. I understand this concept.
Here is where I am stuck. If the supercomputer undertook this in depth analysis and optimization, how could anything be improved upon the first round of optimization, absent some new material that could be thrown into the equation. It would seem almost impossible to find engineering improvement after the first year’s use of the supercomputer.
What am I missing?
[/QUOTE]
You’re missing that things like the shapes change, and that changes the mass properties as much as materials do, and shape can be footprint, depth, width, sole shape, all of these things alter the equation, and AI will come up with different optimal solutions because of that.
It’s why one face doesn’t work forever, never has and never will, no matter how some companies try to use the same tech forever there.
If looking at one design, it becomes using the permutations to tweak things and get it to what they see as optimal. Why do it once, when you can run it thousands of times? It’s why AI is superior to the old methods IMO.
[QUOTE=”Muchmore18, post: 10339562, member: 56094″]
Absolutely it could be! But shaft and ball could make just as much of a difference if you’re still looking for the forgiveness of one of the other models!
Don’t get too sucked in to what skill type of player the models are “supposed” to be for though. There’s something there for everyone and why trying them all will be important
[/QUOTE]
Couldn’t agree more. My miss is generally a pull hook if I transition too fast. With mavrik line after hitting them I had a mavrik max with a weight in heel surprisingly. I hit it so much straighter than the standard mav for some reason. The standard mav I could hook off the planet. I had some hooks with mav max but for the most part I was able to keep it pretty straight / baby draw. It was also longer for me by 5 yards or so over standard mav. I’ve had alot of success trying clubs “not meant for me”. Really won’t know till you try it.
[QUOTE=”Jman, post: 10340182, member: 1579″]
You’re missing that things like the shapes change, and that changes the mass properties as much as materials do, and shape can be footprint, depth, width, sole shape, all of these things alter the equation, and AI will come up with different optimal solutions because of that.
It’s why one face doesn’t work forever, never has and never will, no matter how some companies try to use the same tech forever there.
If looking at one design, it becomes using the permutations to tweak things and get it to what they see as optimal. Why do it once, when you can run it thousands of times? It’s why AI is superior to the old methods IMO.
[/QUOTE]
Is the supercomputer only employed for face technology, or is it used to design shapes as well?
Boy….the Max Triple Diamond LS looks soooooooo good!
Love the matte crown. way behind on things today so will have to backtrack later to read the Grandaddy crew’s thoughts.
Tentatively planning a driver fitting in February and these will be tried!
[QUOTE=”Cruskater, post: 10339688, member: 60027″]
Yes, the price is an issue, but with visible and invisible tech, a lot of us will pay a premium for that. Looking forward to hearing more stories from the Grandaddy. Just watched a few YouTube reviews of both the Rogue and the TM Stealths. As an adjustable tinker and a teacher that doesn’t have an endowment for new drivers every year, I’ll stick to last year’s Max LS, but they do intrigue me. Does anyone have ball data from the Grandaddy? Curious about ball speed and spin rates. :giggle:
[/QUOTE]
don’t have direct ball speed comparisons with the Epic Max LS, but the TD LS was consistently above 175 mph compared to 172mph of the TSi3 I was gaming and similar to what I saw on the occasions when I tested the Epic Speed. I’ll note that the shaft was also a 1/2” shorter in the TD LS too. The new lineup is fast. I’ve never seen ball speeds approach 180 on a gamer swing until the Rogue ST.
[QUOTE=”Tevenor, post: 10339980, member: 55541″]
You could always change balls and add in a couple hundred RPM back into it.
[/QUOTE]
The CSX is a good option here!
Big fan of the matte black crown on these. Sounds like Callaway definite covered all golfers with the four models. And the comments provided by the Grandaddy guys certainly are encouraging and very helpful. Can see a definite need for a fitting to determine the best model and shaft pairing to maximize results for each individual.
A little slice of Rogue. Jailbreak looks a little different.
[ATTACH type=”full”]9057378[/ATTACH]
[QUOTE=”Tenputt, post: 10340177, member: 42964″]All of the reviews and feedback, from [USER=1579]@Jman[/USER] to the Grandaddy participants, have been super good. Thanks. I have a question and it is not intended to be a troll.
Callaway has promoted its use of a super computer for several years now. The supercomputer uses artificial intelligence to run millions of permutations to optimize the face technology. I understand this concept.
Here is where I am stuck. If the supercomputer undertook this in depth analysis and optimization, how could anything be improved upon the first round of optimization, absent some new material that could be thrown into the equation. It would seem almost impossible to find engineering improvement after the first year’s use of the supercomputer.
What am I missing?[/QUOTE]There’s always a lot of room for improvement. As a second business I started a software company, so i have some minor knowledge, not a ton, in the area.
AI is essentially strategy to, as best as you can, try to take all variables you can in the environment that you could possibly map, and then create an algorithm that will reliably estimate a real world situation.
So the first iteration of AI for the face they may use variables like speed, face shape, path angle and launch angle and then other variables like average arm length and height weight of the player and see what the computer thinks would optimise launch at all places on the face for the largest variation in swing speeds. And then they release a driver.
But then they realize, wait, why does the data change so much depending on the golfers shoe size, so for the next iteration they calculate it with shoe size. Obviously i dont know what the variables are and this is a silly example but you can see how as they play around and experiment more they’re continuing to fine tune and modify their algorithm so that their AI is more accurate.
So every year should theoretically get better as they learn more and more. Which makes it hard for me to stick with the same driver each year because mentally i think there must be something slightly better, even if that year could have been not that innovative in terms of breakthroughs for their AI.
The Rogue ST Drivers!!!
These things are pretty aren’t they? I have never had a Matte Crown driver prior to this and I think they got it right! The color scheme is very good as well. Black with a beautiful gold accent. They frame ball exceptionally well, too!
We will start with the fitting. I expected to be fit into either the Rogue ST Max LS or the Triple Diamond LS prior to going to the Grandaddy. On Monday each of the versions were passed around and I was surprised at the look of the Triple Diamond. I looked much smaller than the other even though it is only 10 ccs smaller. The deep face helps with that. Gerritt gave me the Max LS to start but I was leaking shots out to the right with it. The numbers were good, he just wanted to get a more neutral ball flight with the driver. He then handed me the Max driver and I knew almost immediately that this was the one. The ball flight were perfect with launch and spin.
Final Fitting Info:
Rogue ST Max 9* with the Tour Issue Green Dot Sleeve set at -2/D to make an effective loft of 7*
Project X HZRDUS RDX Smoke Blue PVD 70 TX at 45*
Golf Pride MCC +4 Grey grip
Videos during the fitting thanks to [USER=40754]@dacatalyst41[/USER]!
[MEDIA=youtube]26hWCCnYkYU[/MEDIA]
[MEDIA=youtube]q7FIcgD3R5I[/MEDIA]
Here are the first few swings with it at the Hideaway with a spectator watching!
[MEDIA=youtube]N2i1U43uUFM[/MEDIA]
The first day of competition was awesome with the driver. I had one loose swing that cost me a bogey but everything else was like I was on auto-pilot. The fairways are way more generous on the Clive than the Dye so that makes sense. The 2nd day was a little more nerve wracking because I was playing against the man, the legend [USER=19461]@JasonFinleyCG[/USER]! I got off to a rocky start off the tee on 1 and 2, but settled in nicely after that. I just have to get used to starting things right of my normal site lines!
[MEDIA=instagram]CYTrGw5lU2x[/MEDIA]
Here are some numbers from my simulator session after getting back.
[ATTACH type=”full”]9057388[/ATTACH]
I am so excited to play golf this spring when the snow melts and the temperature increases.
[QUOTE=”SkiBumGolfer, post: 10339787, member: 15030″]
It’s very interesting to me – and IMO, speaks volumes to the level of forgiveness on offer here – that a pretty large portion of the Grandaddy folks got fitted into the ???. You would definitely expect to see a lot more folks on the other side of the bell curve.
[/QUOTE]
It is interesting, especially considering that Dave Neville said in an interview this afternoon that they’ll be right for maybe 5% of players.
[QUOTE=”MattyD-MPLS, post: 10340558, member: 51852″]
The Rogue ST Drivers!!!
These things are pretty aren’t they? I have never had a Matte Crown driver prior to this and I think they got it right! The color scheme is very good as well. Black with a beautiful gold accent. They frame ball exceptionally well, too!
We will start with the fitting. I expected to be fit into either the Rogue ST Max LS or the Triple Diamond LS prior to going to the Grandaddy. On Monday each of the versions were passed around and I was surprised at the look of the Triple Diamond. I looked much smaller than the other even though it is only 10 ccs smaller. The deep face helps with that. Gerritt gave me the Max LS to start but I was leaking shots out to the right with it. The numbers were good, he just wanted to get a more neutral ball flight with the driver. He then handed me the Max driver and I knew almost immediately that this was the one. The ball flight were perfect with launch and spin.
Final Fitting Info:
Rogue ST Max 9* with the Tour Issue Green Dot Sleeve set at -2/D to make an effective loft of 7*
Project X HZRDUS RDX Smoke Blue PVD 70 TX at 45*
Golf Pride MCC +4 Grey grip
Videos during the fitting thanks to [USER=40754]@dacatalyst41[/USER]!
[MEDIA=youtube]26hWCCnYkYU[/MEDIA]
[MEDIA=youtube]q7FIcgD3R5I[/MEDIA]
Here are the first few swings with it at the Hideaway with a spectator watching!
[MEDIA=youtube]N2i1U43uUFM[/MEDIA]
The first day of competition was awesome with the driver. I had one loose swing that cost me a bogey but everything else was like I was on auto-pilot. The fairways are way more generous on the Clive than the Dye so that makes sense. The 2nd day was a little more nerve wracking because I was playing against the man, the legend [USER=19461]@JasonFinleyCG[/USER]! I got off to a rocky start off the tee on 1 and 2, but settled in nicely after that. I just have to get used to starting things right of my normal site lines!
[MEDIA=instagram]CYTrGw5lU2x[/MEDIA]
Here are some numbers from my simulator session after getting back.
[ATTACH type=”full” alt=”3796F7AB-5D82-4B3E-B3CF-CFD8D309C746.png”]9057388[/ATTACH]
I am so excited to play golf this spring when the snow melts and the temperature increases.
[/QUOTE]
I vividly remember the sound of you mashing driver during the fitting. Fantastic!!!
[QUOTE=”OldandStiff, post: 10340567, member: 53737″]
It is interesting, especially considering that Dave Neville said in an interview this afternoon that they’ll be right for maybe 5% of players.
[/QUOTE]
5% = lunatic fringe.
[QUOTE=”OldandStiff, post: 10340567, member: 53737″]
It is interesting, especially considering that Dave Neville said in an interview this afternoon that they’ll be right for maybe 5% of players.
[/QUOTE]
#LunaticFringe!!!
[QUOTE=”baylrballa, post: 10340569, member: 52381″]
5% = lunatic fringe.
[/QUOTE]
Beat me to it! :LOL:
[QUOTE=”V14_Heels, post: 10338387, member: 53564″]
Super interesting, so you ended up with an LS but Cap ended up with the Max which goes against kind of the marketing words of the LS or Triple Diamond going to the low handicap and max going to the mid to high. Yet again why everyone should get fit I suppose.
[/QUOTE]
It’s all about ball flight. We both found drivers that work! I thought for sure it would be the Max LS for me.
[QUOTE=”TheHeez, post: 10338430, member: 6417″]
Sure do like the look, that gold piece really pops with the simple look. The description on the Cally site sure makes it seem like the standard version and Max are more draw biased. I don’t need LS, let alone TripleD, but also don’t need draw bias. Would be curious what I’d get for to. Can’t wait to hear Jman and the Grandaddy squad get into it!!
[/QUOTE]
Maybe get the Max and use the -1N setting to open it up a bit on the sleeve.
[USER=51852]@MattyD-MPLS[/USER] does setting the green sleeve in -2 crank the face open as well? Any lie changes?
[QUOTE=”dacatalyst41, post: 10338475, member: 40754″]
My initial thoughts:
I went to California confident that my bag was set and would hold it in for another year.
“Everyone has a plan ’till they get punched in the mouth.” – Mike Tyson
Queue the equipment presentation and this woods lineup was the proverbial fist to the mandible that left me on the floor. The hits kept coming but I’ll focus here for now.
I was blessed to get dialed into a Rogue ST Triple Diamond LS driver. Coming from the Epic Speed Triple Diamond that I LOVE, this club had its work cut out for it. My gamer had me hitting more fairways than I have in years with no sign of hooking left. This years Triple Diamond LS head was different. 450cc vs 460cc. Matte finish vs gloss. It has a diifferent weighting configuration as well and the difference is pronounced.
As you can see below the smaller head is heavier. That extra heft makes for tremendous feel and stability in the swing.
[IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/iMvPa6IdaFdY_XtBHaUMGkB52BYAF__z4tDcA3auGzqEkDVrWnjBkb52W9d-FVu1Mhng42Yuqb8MEDyQYTYq2oUdkg16XK9-VHIsFfQ-xNBE-PEUBycS9JTsUTvhG56XXulgyMwp[/IMG]
[IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/uKVeKlpmkSD08JN1r4w8KNMA5clriSLhXhVHz3A-LbP6Gv_2qgPDhXX53p8-T_GcLFxp0M9HXJ_e-IF0n_9EGg9R7MpckwuqqLdqVeUkv942DX0SnREHx2jZg8qqNB9L_okCtBhX[/IMG]
In addition to feel and stability, these drivers excel in the sound category as well. The muted this of the Epic that heralded the arrival of Jailbreak technology is gone and a lively, more powerful “thwack has taken its place. It’s just so good and only gets better in the fairways
Exhibit A.
[ATTACH type=”full” align=”left”]9057170[/ATTACH]
The Triple Diamond LS retains the deep face of its predecessor, along with the straighter tooling and flatter lie preferred by serial faders of the ball. As someone who hates to see the ball turn left, I’m so excited to see this option continue in the lineup and at retail. The carbon crown continues its legacy but this matte version is stunning and easily my favorite iteration by far. As a matter of fact, this just might be the first time in years that I don’t purchase a Callaway Customs option.
[IMG]https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/GKBhC7W-Hwxjj0M0R-DaTMDEDEQiqjQT9D9AeTYn0ZGSDz0DpTueKS5R4seiITGRvuH3K0aJ4rVZG8ZFIK2WMSf-0TlmYGCFO5AcrLTEOBUjxDjhqqNGk0NamUS4At5NuJFP0XC8[/IMG][IMG]https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/g6bkQ5juEWyFEuGhR0v3iEPyXIuhN7GXgzMb6k4fV4nkdx6ixtnW8AgQDnUpaJXk0wBEtN12o8z7SQaq1s5z09eYAVcNmLOKSTWo6wMV07_yy8ICIz4RJ7nPRI0UrIWd3fMunCHR[/IMG][IMG]https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/rYz0OZyhuWDrmUVEYDbxDPUWggZGI_vVA6fxbmg-uHuL7lT3iG_ZeoQ8p7O2JUijFxFKX0ZZ11T2tEjhOi3js959CEIm7ww9Ug5BPeQq-MGeG6Bdzp3uIVHzINhFgz-EKdj1Zkqn[/IMG]
As for performance, this head is leaving nothing on the table. I’ve yet to get on the SIM for numbers, but shot shape and dispersion wise, I see no white flags being raised any time soon. The battle will continue but Epic Speed Triple Diamond is on the ropes. ?
[/QUOTE]
We got punched in the mouth when they walked up on the stage with the staff bag and everyone saw the headcovers and Rogue ST Pros ions!
[QUOTE=”baylrballa, post: 10340569, member: 52381″]
5% = lunatic fringe.
[/QUOTE]
:waves:
Count me in! 🙂
[QUOTE=”MattyD-MPLS, post: 10340581, member: 51852″]
We got punched in the mouth when they walked up on the stage with the staff bag and everyone saw the headcovers and Rogue ST Pros ions!
[/QUOTE]
Pretty much!
[QUOTE=”jfrigo1003, post: 10338294, member: 50601″]
wow pretty cool they come with the new 2022 version of the Tensei AV lineup. Excited to try those out
[/QUOTE]
These are a $300 CAD upcharge on the Stealth.
Callaway lands a haymaker there.
[QUOTE=”baylrballa, post: 10340569, member: 52381″]
5% = lunatic fringe.
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=”RealPretendPsychic, post: 10340571, member: 57192″]
#LunaticFringe!!!
[/QUOTE]
Works for me as a going theory ?
Catching up now on my thoughts on this driver lineup. In the tech briefing I loved the aesthetics. I’ve always been a fan of a matte carbon crown and love the gold accents. When the samples were passed around a couple things stuck out to me. First, I like a smaller more squashed head. (I was previously playing the Epic Speed head in 10.5 and thought it was a great shape and sat perfect behind the ball). Additionally, the flat, matte line along the top of the face is very straignt and for some reason makes most of the drivers appear to sit closed. In comparison, the gloss top of the Epic Speed looks like the toe area is recessed more and sits more open.
In recent fittings going in my swing speed has been a very consistent 97-102mph. At the ECPC, my swing speeds were between 94-100mph. I am currently playing an Epic Speed driver in 10.5 degrees turned down 1 degree with a Ventus Velocore 60s blue shaft. I started with the Rogue ST Max driver which has a noticably larger head and seemed to sit closed behind the ball. I typically hit a slight draw and my miss is often a push way to the right. Driver is a club which can often go off the rais for me. That’s why I started with the forgiveness of the Rogue ST Max. I was giving the left side of the range a workout and having a hard time hitting a straight ball. We started with a Tensei blue shaft which wasn’t working and moved to the same Ventus Velocore Blue 60s shaft which I’m currently gaming. With the familiar shaft I timed it a bit better but was still missing left.
At Justin’s suggestion, we moved to the Rogue ST Max LS driver in 10.5 with a Ventus Velocore Blue 60s shaft. I was still spraying the ball a bit but the shots were overwhelmingly straigther and the good strikes rivaled the best I’ve seen on the course this year. I wasn’t swinging the driver great but this has me encouraged and I look forward to getting more time with this on the range and course. I hit some nice drives with this and there were loose swings I made which showed that no amount of technology can make up for a horrible swing! ?
I never tried the triple diamond LS in my fitting primarily because I know I need more forgiveness with driver. I do like the shape and way it sits behind the ball but I know if I had talked myself into the triple diamond LS I would have struggled on course with it as driver isn’t the strongest part of my game. What I’ve seen with the Rogue ST Max LS has me excited to see how my driving improves. Below are some images comparing the new Rogue ST Max LS 10.5 head to the Epic Speed 10.5 head. I tried to get the shafts sitting parallel at the same angle but camera angles are often misleading.
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[QUOTE=”ArmyGolf, post: 10340580, member: 11776″]
[USER=51852]@MattyD-MPLS[/USER] does setting the green sleeve in -2 crank the face open as well? Any lie changes?
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It is -2* loft is offset a little with the D setting, It is probably closer to 1-1.5 open. The lie is also flatter from what I understand.
I think the ??? is getting an unfair rap! I started my fitting in the Max LS because I fight the lefts. The waaaaaay lefts. After just a few swings and after having watched me struggle with the Apex TCB’s and X-Forged irons, the fitter had me try out the ??? LS. And that was the best fit! The blurb below does mention better players, but it also mentions low spin and neutral-to-fade bias. Fastest most stable drivers ever! If that’s what you’re looking for then give it a swing!
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[QUOTE=”xThor, post: 10339178, member: 19092″]
Exactly! Previously my driver was launching at about 18* with 3100 rpm. Recipe for disaster there for me. I found a lot of fairways, but my misses were horrendous.
Mid to upper 90’s in clubhead speed, with the Max LS, I am now about 13-14* launch, and about 2300 rpm i believe it was. Ball still gets up in the air for me, but much more penetrating, and getting a lot more distance.
My last range session before the Grandaddy, average driver carry was 233, with roll to 245.
At ECPC with this driver, and a proper fitting, my carry was 248, with roll to 273.
I had several balls at the Hideaway in that 270 range, and when I played at the Oasis a couple weeks ago, I was definitely in places with my approach shot much closer than when we played together!
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This is going to be a true game changer for you!
[QUOTE=”Tevenor, post: 10339433, member: 55541″]
“I mean if you like that sort of thing…”
:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
[/QUOTE]
My favorite is the little “ooh” at the 33 second mark right before Clayton says pounded! 🙂
[QUOTE=”93civiccpe, post: 10340588, member: 41068″]
Catching up now on my thoughts on this driver lineup. In the tech briefing I loved the aesthetics. I’ve always been a fan of a matte carbon crown and love the gold accents. When the samples were passed around a couple things stuck out to me. First, I like a smaller more squashed head. (I was previously playing the Epic Speed head in 10.5 and thought it was a great shape and sat perfect behind the ball). Additionally, the flat, matte line along the top of the face is very straignt and for some reason makes most of the drivers appear to sit closed. In comparison, the gloss top of the Epic Speed looks like the toe area is recessed more and sits more open.
In recent fittings going in my swing speed has been a very consistent 97-102mph. At the ECPC, my swing speeds were between 94-100mph. I am currently playing an Epic Speed driver in 10.5 degrees turned down 1 degree with a Ventus Velocore 60s blue shaft. I started with the Rogue ST Max driver which has a noticably larger head and seemed to sit closed behind the ball. I typically hit a slight draw and my miss is often a push way to the right. Driver is a club which can often go off the rais for me. That’s why I started with the forgiveness of the Rogue ST Max. I was giving the left side of the range a workout and having a hard time hitting a straight ball. We started with a Tensei blue shaft which wasn’t working and moved to the same Ventus Velocore Blue 60s shaft which I’m currently gaming. With the familiar shaft I timed it a bit better but was still missing left.
At Justin’s suggestion, we moved to the Rogue ST Max LS driver in 10.5 with a Ventus Velocore Blue 60s shaft. I was still spraying the ball a bit but the shots were overwhelmingly straigther and the good strikes rivaled the best I’ve seen on the course this year. I wasn’t swinging the driver great but this has me encouraged and I look forward to getting more time with this on the range and course. I hit some nice drives with this and there were loose swings I made which showed that no amount of technology can make up for a horrible swing! ?
I never tried the triple diamond LS in my fitting primarily because I know I need more forgiveness with driver. I do like the shape and way it sits behind the ball but I know if I had talked myself into the triple diamond LS I would have struggled on course with it as driver isn’t the strongest part of my game. What I’ve seen with the Rogue ST Max LS has me excited to see how my driving improves. Below are some images comparing the new Rogue ST Max LS 10.5 head to the Epic Speed 10.5 head. I tried to get the shafts sitting parallel at the same angle but camera angles are often misleading.
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[USER=41068]@93civiccpe[/USER] – Great write up, and I can empathize 100% with your driver struggles! What kind of change in spin numbers did you see between the Max and Max LS?
[QUOTE=”RealPretendPsychic, post: 10340594, member: 57192″]
I think the ??? is getting an unfair rap! I started my fitting in the Max LS because I fight the lefts. The waaaaaay lefts. After just a few swings and after having watched me struggle with the Apex TCB’s and X-Forged irons, the fitter had me try out the ??? LS. And that was the best fit! The blurb below does mention better players, but it also mentions low spin and neutral-to-fade bias. Fastest most stable drivers ever! If that’s what you’re looking for then give it a swing!
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I agree. The Triple ??? is still plenty forgiving. May not be as foregiving as the other heads in this release, but compared to past releases, they still have plenty of protection. Hell, I had my playing partner at my sim league try it out at +1 degree at 10 deg and he it 4 of the most consistent longest drives of the night. On a head by all rights he should have no business with with a shaft way to stiff for him ( 20 handicapper, 100 mph driver swing speed, usually drives it 230-240l, miss is a snap hook) . But yet he pounded for drives at 250 to 254 all within 10 yards of each other and all fairly down the middle.
You just have to understand your trade offs. You are giving up additional forgiveness for help keeping the ball going left. If that makes sense for your swing profile, then go for it.
Amazing feeling when you can step onto the teebox with no fear anymore
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I have never been fitted for any clubs so this was my first fitting. My normal flight for the driver is a fade. If I try and crush the ball, that becomes more of a slice. SS is usually around 95-105.
I have never had a Callaway club in my bag prior to this event. Since 2016 my bag has been all Titelist. Why? I was hitting different clubs at GG and the 716 irons stood out. I liked the look and feel. Next thing you know, the whole bag was Titelist.
My old driver is the Titleist 910 D2 at 9.5 on A1 setting with Diamana S+ R 62g shaft. I have hit good shots and bad shots. My last few rounds with it were pretty good. [USER=69044]@Sarzar[/USER] and I played a round with [USER=57192]@RealPretendPsychic[/USER] in September and I hit most of the fairways that day. I was actually hitting the driver very well that day. I was hoping that swing would show up for fitting time. In October, I met some of the GD crew, plus Canadan and Kygolfer. The driver swing wasn’t as good as September but not too bad.
I don’t really have a preference for looks but if your not confident in looking down at a club, you will not be confident swinging it then either. I was very impressed with color scheme on the new Rogue ST drivers. When they passed them around, you could see everyones face start to smile and grin. I really liked the matte crown with the thin subtle gold/orange line wrapped around it. I was pretty confident that I could stand over this driver with no issues.
During the fitting I did not have my best driver swing but Jason was confident the Max D was best fit for me. Jason fit me into a 9 degree Max D head on setting D/-1, so 9 turned down to 8 degree. I was still able to get a good ball flight height at 8 degrees. I was fit into the Fujikura Ventus 5S shaft. I do not know much about shafts but we tried a few different ones and this one had best numbers for me that day.
My row home in Philly is not big enough for a sim room so I will need to hit up an indoor sim to get some numbers posted here later.
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On the course this preformed very well. I did have some mishits but the face seemed very forgiving, making a slice become a fade and still find either the fairway or rough. However, I did have a few wayward shots that [USER=48554]@Vader[/USER] can attest too. He is still alive with no bruises or eye patches.
Hopefully the more forgiveness in the face helps my handicap trend down next year.
You’ll notice I have a very short/abbreviated backswing with the driver but I feel it helps me with tighter dispersion than when I bring it all the way back.
[MEDIA=youtube]1Vr7DTv9-KY[/MEDIA]
So overall, the driver looks good to me, sounds good to me, and will be in the bag for a long time. Hopefully I can get on a launch monitor within the next few months and hit both drivers against each other get some data.
[QUOTE=”Snowman, post: 10340623, member: 3386″]
[USER=41068]@93civiccpe[/USER] – Great write up, and I can empathize 100% with your driver struggles! What kind of change in spin numbers did you see between the Max and Max LS?
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Take into account that I wasn’t hitting a lot of good shots with the Rogue ST Max but they were in the 2700 range whereas the Rogue ST Max LS was in the 2300-2400 range.